Assisted Suicide

[Shu]

I know it's been years since I've heard the name, Dr. Kevorkian, but when I hear the name my feelings still remain neutral. He was formerly known as Dr. Death because he helped over 130 people kill themselves after counseling. He had his medicine license revoked due to it, but was charged with murder in which it was later dropped since there were no laws against it. To me, I think it's a choice in the end, though I'm not still sure how I feel on the subject of having someone else doing it in a humane way.

Meh, you could either be the person who is like "one less oxygen sucker", but still suicide to me is a harsh subject. Though what are your feelings on "assisted suicide".

Do you think it's right? OR do you think it's awful that this man would do this for people?

 

[Shaissa]

Been a while since I heard this..
I have to say I am still torn on the subject, most of the people he helped with their suicide had uncureable diseases and were going die most painful deaths weren't they?

I mean this whole "assisted suicide" debate is a very touchy subject and I'm not sure which way to throw my vote.

I can say it is wrong and say how life should be cherished and we should make the most of it, and should be grateful for every day we have, and its wrong to help people end their own lives faster...

But at the same time I can argue what if I have some deadly disease that will make life painful and I'd do anything to end the pain faster, and needed help in doing it from a doctor or anyone?

I mean Don't get me wrong I'm not saying that people that are depressed should find help in killing themselves, they should seek help on how to get over depression, but as far as some diseases go... Very tough call to make...

 

[Jack's Smirking Revenge]

i'm completely for it. i think if someone wants to kill themself, they have every right to be allowed to do it painlessly, like people like dignitas offer. i don't even think there should be a moral argument against it. at the end of the day, it's the person who's committing suicide who has made the choice, and not the one assisting.

 

[ribbit]

I'm not really for this... I think suicide is terrible, and that people's usual reasons for suicide aren't good either, but if you really want to end your life that badly, it's up to you :/ I don't like the idea of assisting because if you need assistance, you probably aren't too sure yourself, making it more of him convincing them to commit suicide. They want to, but deep down they might not. I'm not sure what his methods are, but I don't think I really want to know. Suicide should never be an option.

 

[bearsfwd]

Suicide in ANY form is the lame way out (apologies to anyone who has had someone in their life commit suicide). If it's something you want to do, fine, do it, but you won't get any pity from me.

***Modified for what Manic said below***

Someone who is barely alive to begin with, due to being kept alive with machines or whatever, I suppose is acceptable, because either way, your life will end. I personally would much rather go out on my own terms instead of letting a disease or whatever take over. Obviously I'd have to be at the point where nothing else can help ma and I'd have probably just a few days left to live.

But if the assistance comes from somewhere other than a licensed doctor, then I don't agree with it.

 

[Will Graham]

I think people are misunderstanding the concept a bit, it doesn't mean helping your friend Toby who's a bit blue top himself over the weekend. It is generally when someone is being kept alive solely by machines, or medicine and are in excruciating pain with no hope of being cured. Basically terminally ill people who live in endless suffering, asking to be gently put to sleep and euthanised

 

[Jack's Smirking Revenge]

Suicide in ANY form is the lame way out (apologies to anyone who has had someone in their life commit suicide). If it's something you want to do, fine, do it, but you won't get any pity from me.

***Modified for what Manic said below***

Someone who is barely alive to begin with, due to being kept alive with machines or whatever, I suppose is acceptable, because either way, your life will end. I personally would much rather go out on my own terms instead of letting a disease or whatever take over. Obviously I'd have to be at the point where nothing else can help ma and I'd have probably just a few days left to live.

But if the assistance comes from somewhere other than a licensed doctor, then I don't agree with it.

i don't think assisting suicide is in a doctor's job description.

 

[ribbit]

I think people are misunderstanding the concept a bit, it doesn't mean helping your friend Toby who's a bit blue top himself over the weekend. It is generally when someone is being kept alive solely by machines, or medicine and are in excruciating pain with no hope of being cured. Basically terminally ill people who live in endless suffering, asking to be gently put to sleep and euthanised

Yes, but the patients that this doctor worked with weren't in that sort of medical state. "According to a report by the Detroit Free Press, 60% of the patients who committed suicide with Kevorkian's help were not terminally ill, and at least 13 had not complained of pain." Now, I don't know too much about this guy as this is the first I've heard of him, but it seems to me he was convincing his patients to commit suicide for no apparent reason.

If they were in that sort of state, I'd say that makes more sense. I'd rather have the plug pulled than be kept alive solely by life support, etc.

 

[Shu]

Been a while since I heard this..
I have to say I am still torn on the subject, most of the people he helped with their suicide had uncureable diseases and were going die most painful deaths weren't they?

I mean this whole "assisted suicide" debate is a very touchy subject and I'm not sure which way to throw my vote.

I can say it is wrong and say how life should be cherished and we should make the most of it, and should be grateful for every day we have, and its wrong to help people end their own lives faster...

But at the same time I can argue what if I have some deadly disease that will make life painful and I'd do anything to end the pain faster, and needed help in doing it from a doctor or anyone?

I mean Don't get me wrong I'm not saying that people that are depressed should find help in killing themselves, they should seek help on how to get over depression, but as far as some diseases go... Very tough call to make...

Only 60% from what I read. The other just wanted out of life. People did not have an actual will to live anymore and were either severely depressed or just damaged mentally.

This thread is not just about Unplugging a machine, I'm talking about people who actually just don't care to live any longer, and don't wish to go in their closet and find their grandfathers old colt 45 to end themselves.

 

[Yaoi Master Gavin]

The way I see it, the ability to commit suicide is a natural right that should not be tampered with. Assisted suicide is simply asking someone to help you do it in a relatively painless (compared to other ways available) manner.

I've read a bit about Kevorkian awhile back. What he did was create a euthanasia device that at a twist of a wheel/ push of a button (he had, I think, 3 machines) would deliver a lethal dose to the patient. Allegedly, the patient had to do it themselves.

Much better than jumping off a bridge or summat like that. So yeah, we have the natural right to suicide if that's what we choose.

 

[Abstract Debauchery]

When it comes to people that are depressed and "have no will to live", I honestly believe we're better off without them. At that point, they contribute nothing to society, they have no plans to contribute, and if they are contributing, they're unhappy and don't want to. If they don't want to live, I would be more than happy to point them in the location of a good therapist, or a bridge that's pretty high up. I think Red said it best when he said, "get busy livin', or get busy dyin'".

Let them kill themselves. Being depressed doesn't warrant an assisted suicide.

Now, for people that are pluged into machines who are being kept alive against there will and literally can't do anything about it, they should have the right to choose. I know if I'm plugged into some machine with no way out and I'm told that I'll never be able to wipe my own ass again, I'm going to want someone to pull that plug and let my sorry ass die. I don't want to live that way, not in the slightest. Shit, you can hardly call that living.

 

[Linnaete]

As morbid as the thought may be, assisted suicide can often be the most compassionate thing you can do for someone. It may pain you to think about it, but if a relative or a close friend has developed incurable motor neurone disease and the condition has crept into the very late stages and you see that this person can hardly move a muscle or speak - let alone breathe - the sheer agony of life like that just becomes crystal clear. There is the controversial matter of whether the patient in question would or could have ever authorised assisted suicide if he or she were in a vegetative state, though if the patient had ever expressed a wish or anything similar in being exonerated from such agony, I would support their wish. Ultimately, we have control over our own lives and what we do with it, and I do believe that we also have that right to die - to just end it. As assisted suicide is illegal in this country, no matter what reasons you have in committing the act in the first place - no matter how compassionate it may have been - you would still be charged with murder, so it becomes no wonder that there are Brits who fly out to Switzerland to just pull the plug in a Dignitas clinic.

To just legalise this sort of thing definitely has its complications, which is certainly why it's still illegal here. There's the argument that it could open up the floodgates to the assisted deaths of individuals who were never terminally ill, but killed for personal and selfish reasons. Whether this possibility has enough legs to stand on or not, it's enough to tell me that assisted suicide should clearly remain in the domains of those who are desperately and terminally ill and also have consented in whatever form to end it. If there are able-bodied people who just wish to end it out of sheer depression I won't condone their actions to just commit suicide like that when things have become pear-shaped, but it's their call. However, the more compassionate thing you should be doing rather than assisting such a person to kill themselves would of course be to provide them with extensive counselling.

 

[Roland_Deschain]

Its hard to feel either way about this fully. On one hand I do admit its the humans's right to end their own life. Although if they are in dire need of help I think society should definately attept to stop and help them (if they can.)

Now when you are talking about Assisted suicide, its a very broad spectrum. So I guess I will lay out a few ideals I have on this subject.

I think if a termally ill person wants to pull the plug, then they should find someone who is not a doctor to do it, or to do it themselves. If we allow control over death by doctors who cannot always be trusted and seen, I can only imagine we would find problems and moral contradictions to such a law.

If you are healthy, and ask your (stable) friend to assist you in suicide, I think it should be agaisnt the law to assist them. We never know if a person is crying out for attention, or really wants to die. I think its one of the reason partial and un completed suicides happen, and I think a friends priorities should be to try and help in other ways.

So on one hand while I cannot find any debate agaisnt suicide alone, and have trouble debating the idea of assisted suicide. However, on the other hand if we were to allow such a thing, I am sure that it could present itself with plenty of problems worth debating later on. I am a humanatist person, I don't think troubled minds are worthless. I mean remember the movie "A beautiful mind?" The guy wasn't suicidal but he was completely deranged, yet was able to achieve a nobel prize in his genius that undeniably exsisted. The point is that you never know how valuable a human life is until you know.

Its something to think about definately. If a law were ever to be passed, making it not a crime to assist with suicide, I think we could possibly find a lot more murder cases. People will just say "My friend asked me to kill him."

In my own opinion though, I would never want to see any laws that protect or offer sympathy to someone assisting suicide.

 

[bearsfwd]

i don't think assisting suicide is in a doctor's job description.

No, but if you are in the hospital on your last legs due to a disease or some other circumstance and your life is pretty much over, I'm pretty sure you have the right to request your life be ended. Whether that means they shut the machines keeping you alive off, or whatever other means. If the means is by medicine though, I think doctors can only prescribe it, but can't actually give it to you. You'd have to take it yourself.

 

[Donald Trump]

I think that if someone wants to kill themselves then they should be free to do so. It's the ultimate act of free will to chose to end your life. If people really want to die then they should be allowed to do so.
The only problem I had with the thing was that it sounded like Jack Kevorkian didn't refer people to a psychiatrist. I think people who say they want to die want help or attention more than they want to die. But if they go and still want to top themselves then I'm fine with that.

Its something to think about definately. If a law were ever to be passed, making it not a crime to assist with suicide, I think we could possibly find a lot more murder cases. People will just say "My friend asked me to kill him."

Actually I think the opposite is more likely. If it were legalised then it would be regulated etc. Forms would have to be signed etc etc. That would decrease the chances of someone claiming assisted suicide when in reality it was murder.

 

[Roland_Deschain]

Actually I think the opposite is more likely. If it were legalised then it would be regulated etc. Forms would have to be signed etc etc. That would decrease the chances of someone claiming assisted suicide when in reality it was murder.

How would you propose we would do such a thing. I mean not all suicides are well planned out. When I was in college one of the people I knew near the dorms simply hung himself after a breakup. If we were to allow a system of assisting suicide do you think it would not become confusing for those who are the ones assisting? Scenario : A guy rolls over to his friends house and is asked to assist in his suicide. This person does not know about these forms and documents because he has never thought about suicide personally, but its the only chance to assist. Now I think a courtroom trial of a situation like that would turn into a nightmare, where the only feasible information would pertain to what that assisting person has to say.

Now for my opinion. I guess I do not think advocating a system for citizens to assist in the ending of a human life is very ethical. It takes away from the whole aspect of giving help. I think if people want to kill themselves, then that is their decision. It is not fair to ask another person to be subject to their own depression and ill mind. Furthermore it is something that could come around to disturb and haunt a person, with their own guilt and the pressed guilt of the departed's family.

I guess I would rather we handed out forms to institutionalize, instead of forms to end lives.

 

[asm]

I don't know who's to say what qualifies as a "rightful" suicide, but yes, I think it should be allowed in some cases. Considering you're considered not of sound state if you want to off yourself without no specific reason, I don't see what's the problem really? Things like that easily exclude the people who "shouldn't have a right" to off themselves. Clinically depressed, etc. etc.

Certainly I hope everyone finds something in life that's worth living, but to suggest I should be able to dictate that someone that's conscious and mentally of sound state, should be forced to life in horrific pain for years because of some crippling and debilitating illness, simply cause I feel some mushy feeling with the words "sanctity of life" is beyond selfish. How about sanctity of death for a change.

PS. Arguing whether Jimbob should be allowed to off himself after Daisy broke up with him is kind of irrelevant. Jimbob at least in this scenario, is perfectly able to shoot himself in the face if he wants to. The question of assisted suicide arises when someone is physically incapable of rendering himself worm food.

 

[unadulteratedawesome]

I don't think suicide can be considered fundamentally right or wrong. Personally, I feel that if you have the capability to kill yourself (physically), you should be allowed to. I don't think assisted suicide should be a legal option in that case. If you don't have what it takes to kill yourself, you shouldn't be assisted in doing so.

However, if you wish to die and are unable to do it yourself (for instance, you are terminally ill or in a hospital, or are perhaps paralyzed), you should be able to have your suicide assisted. I'm not sure how to structure the legal constraints and checks on this, but I feel that the choice should be there. The details of how it is done and the legal situations is an entirely different discussion.

Your right to life is your most fundamental right, and I feel that stopping someone from committing suicide who is not in such an extreme situation that they can't think clearly is a violation of that right (even if you're close to the individual). It's their life - how can you really have say over that? Your moral views are out of control when they gain the power to stretch so far as to take that choice from them.

 

[Ghost]

When it comes to people that are depressed and "have no will to live", I honestly believe we're better off without them. At that point, they contribute nothing to society, they have no plans to contribute, and if they are contributing, they're unhappy and don't want to. If they don't want to live, I would be more than happy to point them in the location of a good therapist, or a bridge that's pretty high up. I think Red said it best when he said, "get busy livin', or get busy dyin'".

Let them kill themselves. Being depressed doesn't warrant an assisted suicide.

Are you for real?

People who are depressed have usually slipped into it because of various saddening circumstances or they have a mental health condition. Both can be treated, and neither deserve to be helped to find a "bridge that's high up".

As for assisted suicide, I think that if it comes to a wasting disease and/or other similar circumstances, then a person has the right to choose to die with their dignity and without them or the people they love having to suffer living through the physical and mental pain of witnessing their own slow demise.

 

[Rapture]

I don't personally agree with assisted suicide.

I know there are some people who may be severely depressed out there and may not feel like living anymore...but I personally could never be the person to end their life. I know we all have troubles of varying degrees and I could only know a person's life if I walked for a day in their shoes, but I do not believe that ending a life is the solution to any problem. Life is worth too much to be so easily compromised and tossed away with the passing case of depression or a rough patch in someone's life. There are a lot of medical and non-medical ways to help treat depression...and I can't possibly gather that assisted suicide would be one of them.

...and in the cases of the people who are end-stage cancer and living their final days in pain and etc...there are very good pain medications like morphine out there to help ease the pain before their passing so I don't really see assisted suicide as an answer there either. I know there is a degree of suffering there, but there are ways to ease the pain...and therefore the suffering in these cases.

I can't imagine having a family member with no brain activity on a vent though, I can only imagine how heartbreaking it is. To see someone you love live day in and day out without showing mental indications of life and seeing only the physical by way of a machine has to be hard. I'm sure they always have a hope that the person will miraculously wake up and start functioning has to always be a passing thought in their minds. If the person goes for a long period with no indications of improvement and an overall poor medical prognosis than I can understand the reasoning behind "pulling the plug."