The Madonna Effect

[Ayumi Hamasaki]

I love Madonna to death, as you can see by my avatar and my sig, but sometimes I wonder if what she's doing is okay. She's like 51 now, and she's still making her self a sexual symbol. She's been doing it for years, but it just hit me the other day that she's about the same age as my grandmother. I hate when my grandmother behaves this way, so why it's okay for Madonna to?

Anyway, my question I liked to pose is, is it okay for an older lady, let's say over fifty, to still behave in an overtly sexual way? Or is it immature on their part?

I've decided how to feel about it, minutes after reading the first two posts, and I have to say that I support it as well. It's her body, and if she wants to show, it's her god given right as an American. And as a lady.

 

[Ironman]

Personally I don't really care, I mean, if an older woman still has the vitality of a younger woman, then good for her, and if she has the looks (like madonna does) then all the better, i say good for her. Everyone is different, and Madonna shows this with the fact that she is infact over 50, but she still looks as hot as a 30 year old.

good for her, and if behaving like she does make her feel better about being older than the other pop stars, then i think she should do it, because she is a good music artist, and she is quite attractive (but lets face it, she aint no Taylor Swift )

 

[Shu]

Well Madona wasn't the first mind you too act like this, yet she did survive past Marylin Monroe's lifetime.

What makes it right or wrong to be a sex symbol in the first place? It has to do primarily with the viewers supporting her or not. I mean if people consider her hot still, well then go for it.

I mean we have already had so many spin offs of her including Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera (who actually has a voice), and many more.

The point is people will still think they are pretty when they are above the age of 40, and good for them. I'm tired of hearing others be so damn condescending about the older generations.. but I don't mind saying it I've seen some pretty hot 50 years (granted it might have been from surgery), but still.. that's pretty cool.

Like I said, it's the viewers though that let people know what's hot or not or what lets these musicians go to their head with it. If they were not hot in the first place, do you think their career would of gone anywhere?

 

[niesl2]

It's indeed her own right as an American, woman, human or whatever to appear in public as she pleases. However, on some occasions I think she could have gone for a more stylish option then an outfit that is basically 'underwear with some extra's'. She may look as good as a woman 20 years younger, but she has the intellect of a woman of here own age (at least, I hope she does ), and they probably know some other wardrobe tricks to seduce the audience besides the age old 'bikini+woman=hot' formula.

Also, I can't help to think 'Oh my god, she's as old as my mom!' whenever I see her, which increases the ickyness-factor of the outfit

 

[Daenerys]

I say if you've got it, flaunt it. If Madonna, or any other older woman, wants to dress like someone twenty years younger, why should it matter? If they’re confident and happy with how they dress, do we really have the right to judge them? Not all older people are past it, and if they want to dress like that, I see no problem with it.

I have to agree with Shu, people are pretty condescending about older people, sometimes to the point of it bordering on ageism. If older women can dress like that, feel happy, good about themselves and not look stupid, then more power to them.

Especially people in the music industry like Madonna, in a superficial industry where people often value looks over talent, I think it's admirable that she's still able to keep up with the younger stars.

 

[Dee]

Well, Madonna is a different story. She's a performer, and thus, she needs to entertain people. The reason she has such a nice body is because she trains for it, but not also that. She needs to be able to simply do these things on stage while she performs because a lot of it is very difficult to do; especially when you get older. In Madonna's case, I'll have to give her the benefit of the doubt. Like I said, she's an entertainer and she can do damn well what she pleases. Her fans would be devastated if she decided not to perform anymore because she was 'too old'.

As for non-entertainers/average-joes, sure. Why the hell not? They should have free range to do whatever they want as long as it's not against the law. Sometimes you just gotta do things to feel young again.

 

[Catnip]

Well... she's 51, not 15. It's perfectly fine and I applaud it. She's fit and confident and I actually think her behaviour should be encouraged for women no matter how old they are. And to be completely honest, it's really the least of anyone's concern. There are other stars out there -younger stars- who are doing such minor things that catch everyone's attention.

 

[Exoskeleton]

I'm fine with it as long as she isn't flaunting it all over the place, which she isnt. I dont really think of her as a "sex symbol" anymore because she isnt overly sexed and its not like she's throwing her body all over the place. She has kids, and you can see how she tones it down a little. But then again she's a performer....but performers dont have to do what she does. If shes still trying to be a sexy symbol, she's just sticking to the thing that made her rich in the first place and there's nothing wrong with that!

 

[Sir Kenneth]

I remember taking the train back to my hometown from Copenhagen a little more than a year ago. At one of the stations where the train stopped, a man got on the train. He must have been around 35 or 40 years old, yet he was dressed as a 14 old complete with one of those brightly coloured hoodies, spiked shaggy hair, and his jeans drawn down so that you could see his Calvin Klein underwear. He looked creepy, ridiculous, and undignified and so does Madonna.

I don't think there's anything wrong with a 51 year old wanting to be sexy and all that jazz, but surely there must be some more age appropriate and dignified way of achieving that. Her music videos and stageshows look exactly like those of her teenage/20-something counterparts and that's just weird.

 

[L]

I don't really care.

Some stars will always do what they want, precisely because some of them aren't tools, who are controlled by all the mixed opinions of society, expecting them to act like an ideal role model that fits everyone's expectations.

But really, people will live how they want, and I don't have a problem with someone living their life the way they want as long as it does not personally effect me.

 

[M1ghty Mous3]

I don't really care. Not that I'm for the behavior or opposed to it. I just don't care about Madonna. Her music never interested me and i don't watch any award shows. If she wants to go around acting like she does, good for her, if she decides to stop tomorrow, good for her. It doesn't change my world any in the slightest.

 

[10th Doctor]

I think it's fine. I mean, Madonna is really good looking (thanks to plastic surgery). And she sings a lot. If she started to look wrinkled and older, do you really think people will keep going to her shows? No. And its kind of cool that shes able to make herself a sex icon. It gives older women hope too.

 

[SapphireStar]

Stevie Nicks said "If you have it, flaunt it" and I guess in todays society, thats true. Sadly my cousin who is 14 and my 48 year old mum love wearing next to nothing as they think they have great bodies. It embrasses me because theyre family, but as for Madonna and celebs, I dont mind. She can look a right state, specially in the video where shes in a pink leotard. Bleh.

But I will say. The Hard Candy CD cover makes me baff slightly:

 

[Apparent Amarant]

I don't think it's ok for anyone to act and dress that way. Women always complain about the views society is pushed on them and how they are exploited. Well you don't have to act that way. You do not have to have celebrity role models. It's actually disgusting regardless of how attractive the woman is. Female role models need to get a grip and set a good example. I'm not saying male role models are any better but they aren't relevant to this topic.

I don't care about Madonna but I care about female youth. Supposedly (according to the more intelligent young women I know) they are subjected to certain ideals and images of what they should be and therefore exploited and pushed in a demeaning direction starting at a young age.

If this is true and the young mind is that impressionable by people of celebrity status then women like Madonna need to get a grip and grow up and start setting a good example. This goes for the younger women role models as well.

 

[Encirnia]

Is it okay for older women to act how they want, including acting sexy? They have the freedom to do so, and as long as it makes them happy, they have all the justification they need. It has no obvious detrimental effects on the nation or the globe, and little girls can find worse icons to follow (parental guidance and thoughts aside).

Our society is full of conflicting morals, views, and desires. Diversity is good when it comes to examining issues or manners of debate. Just because someone who can easily become 'in the spotlight' isn't behaving as expected doesn't make her right or wrong. It's her life. She lives where her right are protected so long as they don't violate those of others, and she isn't doing any such thing.

 

[blakstang98]

I think it all really comes down to 1 thing, and 1 thing only. Madonna has always, and probably will always, use controversy as a tool to get ahead in life. When I was growing up in the 80's and 90's, Madonna was always in the headlines for something she did or said. Bottom line is, as long as she's a "musician", she needs to be constantly promoting herself, even if it's in a negative light. Even though she's wealthy (I believe, I'm not sure if she spent it all relentlessly), she wants to keep funds coming in, instead of fading away and being completely forgotten.

If she's 51 and flaunting her body, from the standpoint of that being controversial, I really don't see that. I mean, there are other women much older than Madonna trying to portray themself as a sex symbol. Some women of that age look damn good (yes, my MILF chaser mentality is kicking in). But do keep in mind, it may all look good on the outside, but if she takes her cloths off, she'll probably look like a typical 51 year old woman, unless she had extensive plastic surgery (which she probably has, but we don't know that). Who knows, she may pose for Playboy in the near future if the Heff gets in contact with her, and I'm sure many will be intrigued to see what she looks like.

 

[Apparent Amarant]

In response to everyone saying "she can act however she wants" yes and we all can act however we want. We have that right, but people in the spotlight shouldn't abuse that right. Anyone who is being looked up to by young people should stop and see what image they are portraying.

I've done a lot of wrong in my life. I've done some serious soul searching. I would even challenge to say that in my past I was a bigger bastard then anyone to grace this forum. However through that wrong doing and the reactions people have had I have come to a lot of realizations.

Our society believes "do what you want because you have the right to live your life", but the fact of the matter is that your life has a huge effect on many others. You can't simply do what you want all the time. There are plenty of shoplifters that have much less of a negative effect on society then people that young people idolize that warp their influence to simply make more money or disregard the influence that they have. Yet even though they have less of a negative effect since it isn't an immediate effect and you can't say "hey look at what all of these role models did by acting like whores" people don't actually view it as wrong doing. Maybe this line of thinking is just too deep for this thread, because it seems like no one wants to think past the idea of "it's your life live it" when in all honesty ideas like that sound good, but are basically the biggest lines of bullshit ever.

Just like speaking your mind is a great thing it ceases to be a great thing when it's constantly hurting people. Everything you do has an effect on others and you have to be conscious of that effect to some extent, and even more so when you have an influence on people. Especially when those people are young people.

 

[blakstang98]

In response to everyone saying "she can act however she wants" yes and we all can act however we want. We have that right, but people in the spotlight shouldn't abuse that right. Anyone who is being looked up to by young people should stop and see what image they are portraying.

I've done a lot of wrong in my life. I've done some serious soul searching. I would even challenge to say that in my past I was a bigger bastard then anyone to grace this forum. However through that wrong doing and the reactions people have had I have come to a lot of realizations.

Our society believes "do what you want because you have the right to live your life", but the fact of the matter is that your life has a huge effect on many others. You can't simply do what you want all the time. There are plenty of shoplifters that have much less of a negative effect on society then people that young people idolize that warp their influence to simply make more money or disregard the influence that they have. Yet even though they have less of a negative effect since it isn't an immediate effect and you can't say "hey look at what all of these role models did by acting like whores" people don't actually view it as wrong doing. Maybe this line of thinking is just too deep for this thread, because it seems like no one wants to think past the idea of "it's your life live it" when in all honesty ideas like that sound good, but are basically the biggest lines of bullshit ever.

Just like speaking your mind is a great thing it ceases to be a great thing when it's constantly hurting people. Everything you do has an effect on others and you have to be conscious of that effect to some extent, and even more so when you have an influence on people. Especially when those people are young people.

Actually, she can live her own life. What she does in her life, regardless of her being of celebrity status, shouldn't be anyones problem but her own. Do others have to idolize her? Do they have to follow her path in life, acting like such? If people are too mindless to see her as a role model without considering the fact that she takes a controversial approach, then that's their own damn problem.

It is her own life to live, she can do what she wants, and if it comes with a penalty, then thats her problem and her choice. Nobody else is forced to act like her, if they do so, then they suffer the consequences. What they do may not be right, but nobody has the right to tell them how to run their life. If she wants to be promiscuous, it's her own problem, not ours. "Live her own life" is not bullshit, idolizing someone in the spotlight and thinking they are all-knowing and lack flaws, that's bullshit.

 

[Ayumi Hamasaki]

It's sort of a sad excuse to blame other people that you don't even know for your own problems, though isn't it? I know people who don't watch tv or listen to music,and don't know a thing about Hollywood who are still terrible people. It's sad how our society has become one where all we seem to do is toss the blame at other people.

Madonna and older celebrities are hardly marketing themselves to younger children though. And it's the responsiblity of a parent to make sure that their children only see what they think they are ready for. If parents do their job, then people who act like Lindsay Lohan won't effect their children.

Madonna is allowed to behave anyway that she wants to, and she doesn't have to think about how children or teens are going to react to it. That's their parent's job,not hers.

 

[Apparent Amarant]

Actually, she can live her own life. What she does in her life, regardless of her being of celebrity status, shouldn't be anyones problem but her own. Do others have to idolize her? Do they have to follow her path in life, acting like such? If people are too mindless to see her as a role model without considering the fact that she takes a controversial approach, then that's their own damn problem.

It is her own life to live, she can do what she wants, and if it comes with a penalty, then thats her problem and her choice. Nobody else is forced to act like her, if they do so, then they suffer the consequences. What they do may not be right, but nobody has the right to tell them how to run their life. If she wants to be promiscuous, it's her own problem, not ours. "Live her own life" is not bullshit, idolizing someone in the spotlight and thinking they are all-knowing and lack flaws, that's bullshit.

Your points are mute because we are talking about youths. They are easily influenced. So saying "they choose to idolize who they want to" or whatever is just ridiculous. They are youths so it doesn't mean they are mindless. Society and friends have a bigger effect on who teens become then parents. That isn't my opinion but a widely believed idea.

The problem is the penalty it comes with isn't her own to carry. She doesnt even have to feel it's sting, but honestly it doesn't sound like you are even looking at what I'm saying past level 1.

If you think that people don't have to care about the effect they have on others you are extremely selfish. If you think celerities don't have a bigger effect so they should be even more weary of it then you are naive. You should care how you effect others, because it's your responsibility. Rights are given out as freely as responsibility, and both should be paid attention to.

You can't simply do whatever you want. You just can't, and people who do whatever they want without thinking of it's effect on others are not good people. If they don't care about being good people then that's fine. I just assume most people find that to be important if not the most important thing.

Just because something is allowed doesn't make it ok. It's legal for me to cheat on my wife if I am married but is that really better for me to do then smoke weed? Something being allowed doesn't in ANY WAY AT ALL make it ok or the right thing to do.

Also saying effective parenting would negate the influence is extremely naive as well. There is no way to negate the effect society and pop-culture has on people without locking your child in their room and not letting them read the any current ,newspapers,magazines, literature, use the internet, or watch tv and movies.

Everyone can go ahead and be blind to that fact the celebrities have an effect on society whether people want them to or not. It's not a conscious decision people make, and it's a fact they have an effect. People don't go "OMG I'm going to let THAT celebrity effect me". That's simply not how it works. People Don't CHOOSE to let someone effect them. That's the dumbest idea I've ever heard. It's probably pointless to even point that out because I'm sure it will be ignored by the type of people who believe people choose what effects them. So if your opinion disagrees and you don't plan on doing research on the effect the society has on children then whatever we agree to disagree.