Pedophilia - Is it wrong?

[King Sean]

Pedophilia is seen as wrong because most of the cases had to do with people who were really young dealing with people much older than them. Sure, depending on the content, it may be seen as harmless or non-dangerous. Some people can see the side of pedophilia where it is some little girl with an older man as wrong, while others see the fact that a mature man having interest in a young girl as wrong. I may have to test the mental stability of a man who has such an interest, but as long as he keeps it to himself and does not act on it, it may well be harmless, even though it is heavily frowned upon. Thus, I see pedophilia as generally wrong in most of it's context, but not necessarily wrong in all of it, to a degree.

 

[Æon Flux]

Well, since you asked so nicely I'll share my opinion.

I don't think that pedophilia is wrong as long as they are not commiting voilent crimes. Once a person with pedophilic thoughts rapes or sexually assaults a minor, then I lose the respect/trust that I would have in them. Only at that point have they gone too far.

I don't have a problem with a pedophile who doesn't commit acts of voilence on an innocent child. People who have pedophilic thoughts have committed no crime, at least in my eyes.

It's all a matter of sexual preference. Some younger kids are attracted to older men/women. Is that wrong?

So your basically saying as long as they dont act apon their feelings its ok for them to think these things?

I dont believe it is a natural urge and quite frankly most people with these "feelings" act on them in some way at some point so if they are indeed had I realy think whomever it may be should seek some form of psychological assistance befor they commit an act thet can mentaly scarr someone for life.
Older/younger dating I dont care about,under the age of 13 is a problem for me.
Any thoughts of a child in any form of a sexual way is indeed wrong. Even if at this point the person hasnt acted apon them.

 

[Harlequin]

I see where you're coming from. I worded what I was trying to say wrong.

However, I still am not convinced that a consentual relationship between a young child and an older adult is wrong. If somewhere along the line, the adult goes too far and the child isn't comfortable with it, then yes, it should stop. Merely having pedophilic thoughts (and thus being a pedophile) isn't wrong.

Thank God you said that. I was reluctant to challenge you because your name's in purple.

I agree with what you're saying entirely about being unable to prove the relationship as wrong. I just believe as a christian that such a relationship can and most likely will stunt a child's psychological growth and they may begin to have illusions of greater maturity and build an irrepressable ego based on contempt and resentment.

 

[Donald Trump]

I dont believe it is a natural urge and quite frankly most people with these "feelings" act on them in some way at some point so if they are indeed had I realy think whomever it may be should seek some form of psychological assistance befor they commit an act thet can mentaly scarr someone for life.
Older/younger dating I dont care about,under the age of 13 is a problem for me.
Any thoughts of a child in any form of a sexual way is indeed wrong. Even if at this point the person hasnt acted apon them.

I think natural is a very poor word to use.
Some people would have you believe that homosexuality is not natural. Or that any sexual act that isn't for the sole purpose of procreation is unnatural.
Basically you're saying that they should get help because they aren't like most people. Do you have any proof to suggest that most people with sexual urges act upon them?

 

[Æon Flux]

I think natural is a very poor word to use.
Some people would have you believe that homosexuality is not natural. Or that any sexual act that isn't for the sole purpose of procreation is unnatural.

For THIS particular dabate yes. I will use the word unnateral because quite frankly thats what it is imo. Im not discussing gay,bi what have you since there are already threds for that.

Basically you're saying that they should get help because they aren't like most people. Do you have any proof to suggest that most people with sexual urges act upon them?

In regards to most people having sexual thoughts about minors? Yes I wach the news and that pretty much proves why help should be seeked.

Im not even going to debate weather gay is natural or not or weather all people act apon their sexual desires for the simple fact rape and child molestatiom wouldnt exsist if people could hold their feeling in check.
The "average" person dosent veiw a child in a sexual way and im soley answering in the regards to THAT.

 

[VinnieJones]

It seems that people are just assuming pedophilia is something like a cult, not a disease, where the affected individual is sick and twisted.

I don't think everyone having this idea that pedophilia=evil will help, as it will make it harder for them to seek help; the rejection they inevitebly fear will mean they will hold back when trying to tell others of their state and when asking for help, and hence not allow anyone to make them hold back with their sexual urges.

We tend to shun disorders that cause depression such as pedophilia, while with disorders such as tourette syndrome we tend to sympathise with and grasp, hence they can come out and tell us about their disorder.

I'm just saying tying pedophilia and child sexual abuse is the wrong way to think. one of these cases is definately bad and we know which one that is. the other case leads to this, but if we can help the person at that situation, the bad thing will be avoided.

In a nutshell: encourage peophiles to seek for help before things get out of hand by giving them the comfort of seeking advice, so calling it wrong doesn't help at all.

 

[Rasputin]

So your basically saying as long as they dont act apon their feelings its ok for them to think these things?

I dont believe it is a natural urge and quite frankly most people with these "feelings" act on them in some way at some point so if they are indeed had I realy think whomever it may be should seek some form of psychological assistance befor they commit an act thet can mentaly scarr someone for life.
Older/younger dating I dont care about,under the age of 13 is a problem for me.
Any thoughts of a child in any form of a sexual way is indeed wrong. Even if at this point the person hasnt acted apon them.

You clearly don't have any clue what you're talking about here. Have you ever talked to people who are attracted to underage kids? Observed what qualities in children they find sexually attractive? I have, and I can assure you that it is both natural (from their standpoint) and hardly life-controlling. These people aren't freaks, they aren't the boogeyman out to get little kids, and they're perfectly capable of controlling their own behavior. Nobody is harmed by pedophilia- only sexual assault. There's nothing "wrong" about it.

Keep in mind that there are far more rapes/sexual assaults on adult women then there are kids, but nobody is complaining about "normal" adult heterosexuality...

 

[Æon Flux]

You clearly don't have any clue what you're talking about here. Have you ever talked to people who are attracted to underage kids? Observed what qualities in children they find sexually attractive?

Actually I have. They where mostly teenagers who molested their siblings and other younger family members.
Ive yet to actually talk with someone whom hasnt taken it the next step further than imagination.

 

[Harlequin]

This thread is based on the moral integrity of paedophilia. Not whether or not it's natural which in my opinion, whether you believe it is or isn't, is a weak foundation for any argument.

I believe that we will all be judged by God when we meet our end. This means although I may believe paedophilia to be wrong I can't prove it seeing as I don't have a universal knowledge of morality and philosophically speaking I know nothing.

The concept of morality is based wholely on belief. Paedophilia is against the law in democratic countries because the majority of voters believe (because they couldn't possibly know) it's wrong and subscribe to the school of thought that it should be made illegal.

It's important to challenge every orifice of one's belief. Whether or not it's right because it harms someone isn't the only question we should be asking.

It's whether harming another for your own personal gains is right or wrong. Many athiests would argue that, seeing as no higher being tells them what's right and wrong that there is no right and wrong and that preconceptions of morality when tied into actions are false and indeed weaknesses.

 

[Rasputin]

Actually I have. They where mostly teenagers who molested their siblings and other younger family members.
Ive yet to actually talk with someone whom hasnt taken it the next step further than imagination.

That has nothing to do with pedophilia, it has to do with sexual assault and it happens to LOTS of teenagers regardless of sexual preference. Just because you haven't met adults who aren't otherwise normal people who just happen to be attracted to children doesn't mean they don't exist. You're clearly biased against them due to a few negative experiences, which I can understand, but you need to at least recognize that a good deal of them are pretty much normal, well-intentioned people.

Besides, if it doesn't hurt anyone else, it isn't morally wrong.

 

[Martel]

At the moment, pedophilia is definetely classified as wrong, and it'll take one hell of a justification or argument to get it out of that status. Its just too controversial a topic. Its a cult, its a disease, its natural, those are all pretty poor, undeveloped attempts to justify it, and since there is more than one, naturally all of them are going to be rejected. Since society is governed by the opinion of the majority, and since the majority see pedophilia as one of the most abhorrent acts you can commit...well, its out-of-bounds. I'm surprised there is even a topic on it, to be honest - unless you're analysing it scientifically or psychologically or whatever, it tends to be seen as one of those "taboo" topics you're not allowed to talk about.

...that doesn't actually mean that it IS wrong, though. After all, perspectives =/= absolute. You can label something as "right" or "wrong" but that doesn't make it so, and its doubtful that the label will stick. Eventually, something will change. I can't imagine what, and I can't see it ever happening in my lifetime - after all, I've grown up in a society that sees pedophilia as wrong - but I think that there is a distinct possibility somewhere down the line that it might just go under debate and gain tolerance. After all, do you think people who grew up in a society that shunned and condemned homosexuality ever thought that it would become an accepted (well, there is no law against it, anyway, and society does love its laws) practice? You can say that it is different to things like that, but ultimately it really isn't. It all comes down to perspective, and perspective changes. That is all that there really is to it.

It might sound distasteful, but you can't rule the possibility out. Morals aren't really relevant, they change more often than perspective does. If someone, somewhere, can put forth a convincing argument in favour of pedophilia...well, who knows.

 

[Altair]

Pedophiles are a menace to society. They think that they can use little kids to get their sexual fantasies satisfied. People who do things like that guy should be dragged out into the street and shot. It would make people think twice about doing that type of stuff. We as a society have gotten too lax and let people get away with these things. I'm going to stop now because I'll just rant for six pages or so.

 

[moogling]

Pedophiles are a menace to society. They think that they can use little kids to get their sexual fantasies satisfied. People who do things like that guy should be dragged out into the street and shot. It would make people think twice about doing that type of stuff. We as a society have gotten too lax and let people get away with these things. I'm going to stop now because I'll just rant for six pages or so.

But we don't just go around murdering people like that anymore. I'm sure people thought the exact same things that you are thinking, except in regards of gay people.

The sentence "Pedophiles are a menace to society" is too broad a statement. Pedophiles who don't act upon their desires aren't committing any crime. They're merely thoughts. We don't execute people for having homicidal or suicidal thoughts, do we? We get help for them. We don't just completely shun them.

In regards to most people having sexual thoughts about minors? Yes I wach the news and that pretty much proves why help should be seeked.

That's exactly the problem. Help cannot be seeked, without being automatically charged with a crime or thought of as a criminal.

Thank God you said that. I was reluctant to challenge you because your name's in purple.

I agree with what you're saying entirely about being unable to prove the relationship as wrong. I just believe as a christian that such a relationship can and most likely will stunt a child's psychological growth and they may begin to have illusions of greater maturity and build an irrepressable ego based on contempt and resentment.

Besides, if it doesn't hurt anyone else, it isn't morally wrong.

That's basically what I was trying to say.

 

[Shu]

Let me look at this from a man's man point of view. Let me take away the legalities and move into the moral aspects of it all. Let's diagnose 30+ year olds who have sex with 20 year olds, whether it be men who are older or women. This of course is not pedophilia but in the back of my mind still something pings. Due to at the age of 20 the younger person was 10. Though I have to step away from that because they are fully sexually developed at this point, so it is a conscious choice whether the 20 year old have sex with the 30+ year old.

Now let's get down to the basis of pedophilia. It's rarely seen as women who have sex with teenage men, so I'm going to come at this in a guy's POV. Do I see it as right for a 22 year old fella to have sex with a minor. No. Now let me explain so people don't see it as closed minded.

I've been in enough relationships as well as seen enough fawked up folks to know where I stand when I say, men who date minors who are quite a few years off are cowards. You can say someone is smart all you want, mature for their age all you want, but the basis is.. if you have sex with someone then you are automatically attracted to that person. So if a 20+ year old man is in a relationship with a minor who is 17 years or below, I consider it a bit disgusting. She might have gone through puberty, but the fact of the matter is emotionally she is still developing. All the man wants her for at this point is to establish a sexual relationship. (if they jump straight to sex). No offense but even when single, there are girls who even when they talk the talk, I know they are never even close to walking the walk. There are reasons why I dated 20+ year when I was of the age myself, due to they have been through a lot more emotionally (usually, unless coddled by their parents) that they now how to have a least a healthy relationship, not just purely sexual driven. When you are young, your sex drive is out the roof, for both man and woman, so being at the age of puberty, or just coming out of it is very confusing for a young adult. She might mistake lust as love, and then end up with a crack head. It's just what it is folks.

Furthermore, I would like to point out that the person isn't even living alone yet, their parents are still legal guardians. Depending on their age, they are not legally independent until the age of 18. So if perhaps they do get knocked up, then getting a job and living with the parents would be almost a life ruiner being that young. For one the higher paying jobs are not until you are 18 (legality reasons). So supporting yourself and a kid off of 11,000 dollars a year (w/o benefits) is impossible, considering living expenses now a days are at least 9k when living alone and don't get me started on medical expenses.

I'm not even going to bring up the pre-pubescent folks, if you are above the age 18.. and you are messing around with at 13 year old and down, shame on you. I don't need to explain the psychological trauma this dives into at an early age.

Although I can say many laws I disagree about, this one... I strongly agree with.

 

[Harlequin]

Due to at the age of 20 the younger person was 10. Though I have to step away from that because they are fully sexually developed at this point, so it is a conscious choice whether the 20 year old have sex with the 30+ year old.

Here's where the law buckles a bit and opinions are divided. It doesn't quite matter what age you are when you first experience sexual desires and actions, it by and large traumatises everybody (not necessarily in a negative way) so there's no guarantee a 20 year old is 'fully sexually developed'.

Moreover, the psychological condition plays a significant part in the debate on whether age is a valid gauge. Is a 20 year old who suffers from autism ready to give consent?

 

[Rasputin]

So we've pretty much all agreed that while having sex with minors is wrong (something we all knew to begin with), that there's nothing wrong with pedophilia as merely a sexual orientation?

 

[Harlequin]

So we've pretty much all agreed that while having sex with minors is wrong (something we all knew to begin with), that there's nothing wrong with pedophilia as merely a sexual orientation?

See, although I agree with the sentiment, I don't agree with what you're saying.

We believe acting upon paedophilia to be wrong but none of use could possibly know or indeed prove it to be wrong. Such is morality I'm afraid.

 

[The Witch]

Wow, I think Shu summed everything up perfectly. He really left nothing else to say...

I couldn't agree more with a person about something.


however, I've got to ask one question, though. To everyone here, people who are for it or against it--

What exactly is so attractive about a little girl or boy under the age of 13?

I honestly can't fathom how a sexually undeveloped child(mentally and physically)could be sexy or attractive to someone. Children under the age of 11 aren't thinking sexually nor are they exploring that nonexistent sexual urge. So it really can't be because they're sexuality is exploding. Same thing about the body of the child. Their bodies are undeveloped so could that undeveloped "baby" body be the attractive part?

Is it that a child has no idea what an adult is doing to them that's so attractive to pedophiles? Is it the fact that a pedophiles fantasy involves taking away the pure innocence a child has? Is that where the attraction comes from?

I just cannot understand how or why a child under 13 can be attractive.

So we've pretty much all agreed that while having sex with minors is wrong (something we all knew to begin with), that there's nothing wrong with pedophilia as merely a sexual orientation?

No. That's not what I'm agreeing with. Pedophilia is wrong no matter situation a pedophiliac is in.

And the way I see it, people act on attraction all the time.

 

[Shu]

What exactly is so attractive about a little girl or boy under the age of 13?

To me, and this is a rough, honest truth, I think people are just in it for the submissiveness, innocence and the shape. By shape I mean that some folks, which this is where we call it a mental disorder, prefer really petite folks in general. It is almost child like though.. to be to petite. Think about it.... what differentiates a 20 year old from a 12 year old (physically)? Their bone structure, so no offense to you really petite women (small size, small shape) it would be like dating a minor. That's the hard honest truth for me, and call me a sexist pig or whatever you can throw at me, but that's just my preference to have someone who is the right size both in size and figure.

The submissiveness is really effed up in my honest opinion. Now among men, we have prejudices about you women, that should probably remain in the man hand manual but, we are brain washed to believe that Asian women are submissive. Could be movies, now don't get me wrong I do not believe this, but some times I'm skeptical when I hear a dude brag about how he has a woman that does what he wants, and keeps her in line.

So I believe this is what it falls back to among girls who are not of the age of consent or lower. The physique and the ability to be in control .. etc.. and to be with someone who is a little more naive than the average bear.

Although what differentiates a pedophile and a sexual predator? In my opinion not much.

 

[Rydia]

I was trying to work out a reply but Shu pretty much summed up everything for me.

As for not acting on your urges, if it's only in your fantasy, then I really don't care. What goes on in your mind is all you. However, if you were to tell me that you were attracted to children, due to personal experiences, I will most likely not want to associate with you and I will sure as hell never leave my kids alone with you.

Here is another thought. What about artwork that depicts adults in sexual situations with children? There is a type of anime fan art called Shota that depicts adult men with young boys. I think the female equivevalent is Loli? These images are not real, but are they ok?