Final Fantasy and Philosophy: The Ultimate Walkthrough

I've not read it entirely yet, but I have read about 3 or 4 articles in there.

I think it's really insightful and a good read, but I guess it depends on the article. Some are much more interesting than others, and some seem as if they don't really get around to the point that they are trying to make, or at least don't get deep enough into it.

I bought it a few months ago and overall I do find it to be quite a good book, and worth a buy if you're a Final Fantasy fan.
 
I'm really glad you posted this. I had never heard of this book, but now I'm really excited to read it. Next coupon I get to borders, I'm totally using it on this.
 
I'd actually never heard of this book either, but it sounds quite interesting :hmmm: Thanks for posting this, I'll have to check it out ^^
 
I just went out today and bought it. Will most definitely post a review thread after I'm done. Maybe in a few days? Depends on if I can pry myself away from the videogames.
 
After you guys have read a bit of the book I think we could discuss it here.

Anyone game?
 
After few of you finish chapter 1 we can discuss it. Go ahead and comment on chapter 1 here. I suggest in the future maybe different threads for the different chapters?
 
I'm totally down for that. No telling when I'll get around to actually reading it though...I'm kinda in the middle of FFIV right now.
 
The first part of chapter 1 deals with signifiers and the concept of the writerly text.

Signifiers refers to the fact that each character is in some part customizable, which makes them unique to us. So my Cloud is not the same as your Cloud. This leads us to the next topic in the chapter the wirterly text- where in essence we are able to write our own story by crafting the characters to be what we want them to be. This leads the players to become an active agent in the story.

It is true, that when we are playing and we beat a hard enemy we congratulate ourselves and not the characters.

I think this is one of the best parts of RPG's and video games. Unlike static media (books & films/tv shows) where we are passive participants; FF games allow us to put our own stamp on the game and that allows us to immerse ourselves in the story lines and get more out of playing the game for 40hrs than for watching a TV series for 40hrs.

Other thoughts or opinions?
 
I agree. But I found this particular part of the book was kinda pointless. Well, maybe not the way he presented his argument, but the overall underlying concept itself. Of course videogames are going to be interactive...duh! The fact that you identify with the characters and define them uniquely is also somewhat obvious and within the definition of "videogame". I guess what I'm saying is that most games have the quality of being a writerly text, and that it isn't unique to final fantasy. In fact, I'd be surprised if you could find a game that was not a writerly text (ie, one in which all the signifiers are defined by the developers), especially when your interpretation of the scripted actions of the characters counts as being part of a writerly text. The other comment I'd like to make has to do with what you said, Rydrum, and not the chapter. You said that you'd get more out of 40 hrs of a videogame than 40 hrs of a T.V. show. I don't know if I feel the same way. Sometimes, videogames can be quite boring and uneventful. Like, 40 hrs of grinding? No thanks. I'd rather watch 40 hrs of tv.
 
strife-

Let me address your very first comment, I think parts of this book are going to be "pointless" like this section because it is a book that is introducing Philosophy. So the whole point is to introduce and explain/define what a writerly text is- so from a FF point some parts of the book will be boring.

As to your next point, plenty of video games don't have customization- look at Mario Brothers for instance or games of that type. A lot of first person shooters don't have any customization outside of picking a weapon and maybe what they look like. Changing their looks (or to some extent the weapon) does not change their function in the game. Where as you could make Vincent a "hitter" or more of a "mage" which changes his role in the game.

To address your last point, obviously I didn't mean hours of grinding I was referring to the story part & necessary battles (this is why I used the 40hrs as my number since I think most FF's have about 40hours of plot play). I could just as easily say that 40 hours of commercials is less interesting then grinding.
 
Rydrum - excellent rebuttal, man. Your points are all totally valid. I agree that some of these chapters are probably going to be pretty awful, just because of the whole "introduction to philosophy" thing. I was hoping that the book would be more focused on looking at final fantasy through a new light, and I hope that the rest of the book will be like that. But I just think that this first chapter was somewhat of a lame start...I still have hope though. :) . As far as customization is concerned, i still feel like a majority of games have a considerable amount of it, making them writerly texts. changing your looks and using different weapons in an fps makes your character unique in the same way that making vincent a mage. like constantly using the sniper in halo makes me a very different character than other master chiefs. And i'm kinda basing that off of the points made by the author. At least, that's how I interpreted it. About the 40 hrs thing, i totally get your point.
 
I picked up this book a few months ago. I spent a fun afternoon or two with it but none of the articles were particularly memorable.

I might say something more intelligent about this after I glance at the book again.
 
Strife- I didn't mean that as a "rebuttal" sorry if it came off that way. I am actually like 50% through the book and I can tell you that this is the least FF chapter and other chapters are very different. I just didn't want you to give up on the book after the first chapter.

I actually think the writerly text thing could be interesting conversation. There are lots of RPGs out there with multiple endings (I guess you could argue x-2 in terms of FF games), there you have even more control over the story.

Here is a good question- how much personalization is actually in FF games? and can you really individualize things enough that you can claim (as the author does) that your cloud and mine are actually 2 different guys?

I feel like in maybe FFX, and maybe 8 where you have more control over how your characters function than those are more of the writerly texts than say 6,7,9,12,13.

Your thoughts?
 
Absolutely. FFX and VIII are much more customizable with respect to what your character does. But, I feel like often times, people end up putting characters into the roles that the developers have sorta pre-picked for them. I don't think anybody made Lulu a hard hitter in FFX. I'm sure 9 times out of 10 people made her a black mage. I think the roles are even more deeply ingrained into games like FFIX where vivi is the only one who can cast black magic and garnet and eiko are the only ones who can summon. But, that's not to say there isn't a level of customization and incorporation of the player's ideals/concepts/opinions into the characters in the story. In fact, I read an article today on gamespot about this. It was more focused on nintendo characters and their lack of prescripted character as a bad thing. I've put the link at the bottom of my post, in case you're interested. Anyways, the way I see it, I had a particular vision of cloud, that I generated from my first, second and third playthroughs of FFVII. This was possible because Cloud's character was somewhat open to interpretation (either through lack of dialogue or simple responses or my control of his actions). When Advent Children came out, Square gave Cloud a voice, and defined the character much more clearly. I think a lot of people, including myself were slightly disappointed when square's depiction of cloud did not exactly match up with what we had defined cloud as (individually defined him). I hadn't understood why exactly the cloud from advent children didn't feel 100% right to me until i realized that it was because my cloud was unique. Thoughts? here's the link: http://www.gamespot.com/users/Piers...=convert&om_clk=soapbox&tag=soapbox;subject;1
 
I liked the way it was described. Your Cloud would be different than My Cloud. As I've only beaten X and X-2, I'm mostly going to use that. I've seen AC, but I've only played maybe half of the 1st disc of VII so I don't think I can have a good view on it.

Everyone has a different way of leveling their characters, with the customization feature in it. I always made my characters, EVERY character, mind you, learn basic white mage spells. It didn't matter who it was, everyone knew at least the basic cura, esuna and haste spells. I've known people who had Yuna leveled up in such a way, that she could HIT someone with her stave, and cause *MORE* damage than Auron, who was to be the heavy hitter person. I thought it was best that the more people that can heal, the longer my party will last. On my next play through, I planned on just playing and somehow making everyone know every skill, just because I think it could be fun that way.

Is that the way one is supposed to play? Probably not, one should probably only follow their characters sphere path, and that's that. Doesn't make it wrong in the slightest though. I just wished I could make some of the others summon as well :)
 
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