Is God Good guy or Bad guy???

[Heri666]

This is something that i guess no one ever ask about.
The bible says that God loves all his children, that's he's merciful, forgiving, really nice guy that will send you to hell if you don't believe in only him, if you disobey his laws blah, blah blah. That description seems like one of a tyrant. Your life can be down the toilet but you can't commit suicide because your going to hell, instead he want you to pray, dedicate your life to him and he will answer. This sounds the same as selling your soul to the devil but instead of going to hell you go to heaven. Also, he kicked out Adam and Eve for eating a fruit and he didn't kill Judas when he betrayed Jesus, instead he filled him with guilt and made him kill himself, what a nice guy. He will condemn people that their only fault is that they don't believe in him but will welcome with open arms religious fanatics that kill "in the name of God", whats up with that. Would you follow someone like that???

On a side note: Yea, i don't believe much in God and much less the Devil although i think they're one and the same, but i believe that there's someone guiding and protecting me that isn't so picky, i hope.

 

[Kim Taehyung]

I can't really begin to answer that. I think it's more of an opinion. How you view God/The Divine/The Ultimate/ The Holy Being, etc. isn't always going to be the same as another persons'.

As for myself, I believe more in the deist mind: there is a God, but he doesn't interfere with natural consequences.

 

[Donald Trump]

This is something that i guess no one ever ask about.
The bible says that God loves all his children, that's he's merciful, forgiving, really nice guy that will send you to hell if you don't believe in only him, if you disobey his laws blah, blah blah. That description seems like one of a tyrant. Your life can be down the toilet but you can't commit suicide because your going to hell, instead he want you to pray, dedicate your life to him and he will answer. This sounds the same as selling your soul to the devil but instead of going to hell you go to heaven. Also, he kicked out Adam and Eve for eating a fruit and he didn't kill Judas when he betrayed Jesus, instead he filled him with guilt and made him kill himself, what a nice guy. He will condemn people that their only fault is that they don't believe in him but will welcome with open arms religious fanatics that kill "in the name of God", whats up with that. Would you follow someone like that???

On a side note: Yea, i don't believe much in God and much less the Devil although i think they're one and the same, but i believe that there's someone guiding and protecting me that isn't so picky, i hope.

He is merciful, all you have to do to get into heaven is to repent.
God doesn't send anyone to heaven or hell, how they've acted during their life determines their fate. As to people going to hell for not believing in god, then that's there fault. If god exists then I'm going to hell, I don't believe in god, but if he does exist, it'll be my fault for not having faith. There's Pascal's wager, so you can always make sure that you'll be okay. It's a little unfair for people who lived before Jesus, as they're all in hell. But that's neither here nor there.
And of course god didn't kill Judas, he isn't Zeus, he doesn't hurl lightning bolts at people.
He kicked Adam and Eve out because they weren't worthy of paradise.
Nor does he reward people who kill in the name of god. You're getting confused with martyrs, who get killed. The definition of martyr can be subjective, eg suicide bombers. However the various interpretations of God's will, aren't in anyway his fault.

 

[der Astronom]

Whether or not one believes God to be good or bad is really a subjective opinion--no one can say that he must be good or bad; only that you judge that he is (and I don't want anyone coming in here saying we have no right to judge God; that's neither here nor there. Make your own thread.)

But from what I have seen and heard of him in the bible, I judge that he is a terrible being. From what other people have told me, the only way he can't be seen to be terrible is because the bible consists of human errors (divinely inspired, my ass) and because they have faith. Of course, that's a rather big omission of things that are written in a book, and I never like to ignore things because it preserves no truth, and I still think faith is blind--it's probably almost impossible for me to think of God as a good being.

He is merciful, all you have to do to get into heaven is to repent.
God doesn't send anyone to heaven or hell, how they've acted during their life determines their fate. As to people going to hell for not believing in god, then that's there fault. If god exists then I'm going to hell, I don't believe in god, but if he does exist, it'll be my fault for not having faith. There's Pascal's wager, so you can always make sure that you'll be okay. It's a little unfair for people who lived before Jesus, as they're all in hell. But that's neither here nor there.

But Pascal's wager fails. There are other religions out there, and if you believe in Christianity and you're wrong, you're still doomed.

And of course god didn't kill Judas, he isn't Zeus, he doesn't hurl lightning bolts at people.

But that's kind of like saying Hitler never laid a hand on a single Jew, and yet, we blame him for the holocaust, right?

Just because they didn't do it doesn't mean they couldn't have caused it. That he would wish these things of Judas is already terrible enough.

He kicked Adam and Eve out because they weren't worthy of paradise.
Nor does he reward people who kill in the name of god. You're getting confused with martyrs, who get killed. The definition of martyr can be subjective, eg suicide bombers. However the various interpretations of God's will, aren't in anyway his fault.

I like Marienkind much better. That's the real definition of merciful, not this terrible Christian God. "Worth" is, unfortunately, subjective, and no one can say we are not allowed to disagree with God's criteria of worthy. But perhaps it's because ours is different that we think of him as evil.

But there are examples in the bible in which God does reward or does not punish those who kill in his name. Particularly Moses. He kills off people from these cities and doesn't get punished for it. In fact, God uses him to give laws to people.

Whether or not it's really God's fault is irrelevant to a subjective opinion. If you believe him terrible, then it's natural that you blame him, and you believe it's his fault. It may not be true objectively, but blame is not objective; it is subjective.

 

[Vauel-Faur]

I lol'd a bit at the lightning bolts of Zeus thing.

Anyhow, this is the exact problem I have with the Christian God, never mind the fact that I find the Bible itself a bit far-fetched in some parts to begin with. I think it's all a little misleading and hypocritical, since he is portrayed as the fascist that everyone loves. It reminds me of Stalin Russia, actually.

 

[ZKnight7]

Good and Bad are all relative. For example Sucicide bombers think that it is the good and right thing to kill non Belivers but we would consider that wrong. Who is it to decide who is right and who is wrong. As for god if he was really all mighty he would gives us more proof of his existance. A true good would welcome us regardless of what we did in life.

 

[Dionysos]

Good and Bad are all relative. For example Sucicide bombers think that it is the good and right thing to kill non Belivers but we would consider that wrong. Who is it to decide who is right and who is wrong. As for god if he was really all mighty he would gives us more proof of his existance. A true good would welcome us regardless of what we did in life.

Well there are general moral codes that people abide by, or try to avoid, in general. For example most people would consider taking another persons life as a bad thing, regardless of culture, and such an act would be considered "bad" because the majority would say it is not a good act, and no good comes from such an act. I'd say as far as labelling things as good and bad go most societies would agree on the more extreme things, mostly only civilised societies, but many peacefull remote settlements would agree with this, and have been seen to agree with this as well.

It's easier add these codes to religious texts in order to remind people, and to scare others, and as an incentive to follow them just in case people are tempted to not follow them and do a "bad" deed. If it's in religous texts, then many people who were religious (most people before Science were) would try to avoid commiting this for fear that they will go to hell, be attacked by furies, or hunted down by evil Babylonian spirits etc...

God serves his purpose. His character in the Old Testament is very much like Zeus. He gets angry he kills people... No he kills EVERYONE except one family and a bunch of animals just because he was God and he could. But this was what the Bible was trying to say... God needed to show authority and knock down evil with force, and produce a world with good... Yeah it is twisted, and I don't particulary agree that we should all cuddle up to him like the huggable Santa figure he is seen like in the New Testament, and how he is seen pretty much anywhere. But this is how people thought at the time.

The world before the modern man (well, not us modern, but them when they were the modern man), in their eyes, was chaos and needed order. God provided that order. Only later could God then concentrate on trying to rid the world of bad deeds in a more forgiving, less murderous, way.

The Bible makes a good read though... Find a copy, wack open a page and read it out in a lound booming voice. Pure lol.

 

[der Astronom]

I actually find the God in the New Testament far more horrifying. I know he apparently seems nicer because he isn't actively killing people, but if you go to hell, he makes you stay there forever. And the fact that he's just biding his time just so that he can kill all the people that he judges are wrong and send them to hell in the end makes him evil in my eyes.

I'm not entirely sure what you find makes the bible a good read, but if I knew a good read from ancient times, it's the Elements, not the bible. At the very least, the Elements would probably make me think more logically and better.

But my idea of an ideal creator is someone who actively displays real compassion, and is not conditional about it. He should respect our rights to think as we must or as we will because then he knew that he created us that way, and has no purpose or desire to change our paths--he would know that we chose them, and to change them, regardless of how he might achieve that is a violation of his own creation--he must admit that if we don't turn out the way he expects, it's his fault that he created us that way (ie, the fact that we have feelings, and can think, grow and change.). I do not think an ideal creator would demand faith or worship of us; this of course, goes with what I said about how they should not change our wills or our choice of paths. The ideal creator might have his own agenda, and may differ from ours. But if they conflict, he should try to find a solution that satisfies both sides, and not simply do whatever he wishes; to sacrifice our desires simply for the sake of his own is disrespectful to his own creations, and also a violation of them. If he were to teach us anything, it would be that he sets a good example for us, and not make us do things he does not want us to do--afterall, he made us like that, and if he did those things anyways, he would be a hypocrite.

 

[Captain Jack]

God is a good guy but it free will that screws us over.... our desicions that lead to our ultimate demise

 

[Dionysos]

I'm not entirely sure what you find makes the bible a good read, but if I knew a good read from ancient times, it's the Elements, not the bible. At the very least, the Elements would probably make me think more logically and better.

Well I wouldn't call it an enlightening read. You may not take anything away with you that make you think more logically... I was just meaning for fun. As in a lot of ancient texts many passages are really, really crazy and make you laugh at how people could write them as they did.

But my idea of an ideal creator is someone who actively displays real compassion, and is not conditional about it. He should respect our rights to think as we must or as we will because then he knew that he created us that way, and has no purpose or desire to change our paths--he would know that we chose them, and to change them, regardless of how he might achieve that is a violation of his own creation--he must admit that if we don't turn out the way he expects, it's his fault that he created us that way (ie, the fact that we have feelings, and can think, grow and change.). I do not think an ideal creator would demand faith or worship of us; this of course, goes with what I said about how they should not change our wills or our choice of paths. The ideal creator might have his own agenda, and may differ from ours. But if they conflict, he should try to find a solution that satisfies both sides, and not simply do whatever he wishes; to sacrifice our desires simply for the sake of his own is disrespectful to his own creations, and also a violation of them. If he were to teach us anything, it would be that he sets a good example for us, and not make us do things he does not want us to do--afterall, he made us like that, and if he did those things anyways, he would be a hypocrite.

Yeah, that would be your ideal, and my ideal really as well, but it wasn't the ideal of the writers of the Bible. They wanted people to be scared, to feel intimidated and follow the law of the religion. It's the way religions had always worked. If God really existed, would he be like he is described in the Bible? Who knows. I guess "God" is like however people want him to be like at the time.

 

[Davey Gaga]

God is a good guy but it free will that screws us over.... our desicions that lead to our ultimate demise

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[der Astronom]

Well I wouldn't call it an enlightening read. You may not take anything away with you that make you think more logically... I was just meaning for fun. As in a lot of ancient texts many passages are really, really crazy and make you laugh at how people could write them as they did.

Well, if you put it that way, it makes sense. It'll probably make certain people upset if you say their bible is crazy though, since they like to pick certain bits out of it.

I really don't understand it. There are plenty of other books out there on how to be a better person, that either don't involve God or aren't written so terribly or fictitiously. The problem of fearing God can simply be taken away by showing that Pascal's Wager fails.

Yeah, that would be your ideal, and my ideal really as well, but it wasn't the ideal of the writers of the Bible. They wanted people to be scared, to feel intimidated and follow the law of the religion. It's the way religions had always worked. If God really existed, would he be like he is described in the Bible? Who knows. I guess "God" is like however people want him to be like at the time.

According to lots of people who stand by the bible, it's apparently supposed to be the insipred word of God--if that's true, why is his message so diluted? Yes, I know people make mistakes, but why would God let that haoppen? Why would he let his message, which he probably wants people to understand, be written by people who might possibly like to manipulate things for their own personal gains rather than his own? How can one expect to go to heaven if they don't even know what God's criteria is because he let his message become diluted. Makes no sense.

Which is why it's simply better to just leave it at a text that humanity wrote, and that isn't divinely inspired.

God is a good guy but it free will that screws us over.... our desicions that lead to our ultimate demise

I think he means it's not his fault he's bad, but that we're responsible for all the things that are evil. However, it's true this post could be elaborated more.

But it is undeniable that if the Christian God exists, then he created us. And he also created Satan. He created us with free will, and knew all too well that some of us would turn evil.

Now who's fault is that? Ours? I don't choose the fact that I have free will, the same way I don't choose my gender or my hair or eye color.

 

[Dionysos]

Well, if you put it that way, it makes sense. It'll probably make certain people upset if you say their bible is crazy though, since they like to pick certain bits out of it.

True, to people that follow the Bible by the word perhaps it will... But there is no denying that the style of writing, the ways of writing, and how they got about their points in those days was very different to how we do now, and such a lot of texts from ancient times seem very crazy to us.

If we were to write the Bible now, I'm sure it seem much less crazy in style, while keeping a lot of the similar content, its effect would probably be lessened.

Which is why it's simply better to just leave it at a text that humanity wrote, and that isn't divinely inspired.

I agree. To me the Bible is just one of many of mans attempts to explain the force behind the creation of the universe, and setting a certain set of moral code for its believers to follow. Now God may exist, and he may well have had a nice little chat with Moses and countless other biblical figures, but the writings of the Bible itself should be viewed as being the words of the men who wrote it, most probably for their own purposes and not primarily in spreading Gods true word. I know many people don't view the Bible as such though... And it's awkward to try and tell them otherwise as it would offend them.

I just think that if God wanted to meddle in the affairs of man and help us, he would have done it a lot more often, and more recently than 2000 years ago... Why did he stop helping us after Christ? Many people throughout history have claimed to have been helped by God or Christ, but this is often all down to political reasons in garnering up support more than anything else. I don't think God has contacted anyone on earth for a while, revealed anything new, told us of his divine plan, told us of his new plan to save humanity... Nothing. Why? Possibly because fewer people are using divine intervention to help establish their power, as fewer and fewer people are religious these days... There would also be fear that the world will react to a world leader claiming to have been given a message from God that told him to do this that or the other in todays society, whereas in the past whole armies, and empires would follow one man who said the same thing.

To me, if God exists, he is silent and watching. If he DOES take part in earthly affairs then he doesn't do it often, or at least his efforts are unnoticed as fewer people believe.

 

[der Astronom]

True, to people that follow the Bible by the word perhaps it will... But there is no denying that the style of writing, the ways of writing, and how they got about their points in those days was very different to how we do now, and such a lot of texts from ancient times seem very crazy to us.

If we were to write the Bible now, I'm sure it seem much less crazy in style, while keeping a lot of the similar content, its effect would probably be lessened.

That's why I prefer books like the Elements and other mathematical writings over the bible and other holy scriptures. We may write better versions of the propositions in the Elements, but that wouldn't be the point--you couldn't change the truths in the Elements because every single proposition in the Elements is true. You can change how it's expressed or written, but it wouldn't offend people because it really is objective. At first, it may seem strange that obvious algebra facts are being proved using geometry in the Elements, but then you later realize that for them, it meant a lot, and for us, it shows us how to think in different ways. Anyone can change the bible; no one can say if it's true or not; it only depends on if they want it to be. But you can't do that with the Elements; if you say it's not true, it makes you look stupid.

I just think that if God wanted to meddle in the affairs of man and help us, he would have done it a lot more often, and more recently than 2000 years ago... Why did he stop helping us after Christ? Many people throughout history have claimed to have been helped by God or Christ, but this is often all down to political reasons in garnering up support more than anything else. I don't think God has contacted anyone on earth for a while, revealed anything new, told us of his divine plan, told us of his new plan to save humanity... Nothing. Why? Possibly because fewer people are using divine intervention to help establish their power, as fewer and fewer people are religious these days... There would also be fear that the world will react to a world leader claiming to have been given a message from God that told him to do this that or the other in todays society, whereas in the past whole armies, and empires would follow one man who said the same thing.

And then there are people that suffered because of God. Whether or not they were actually "evil" is all up to interpretation; I'm not simply going to believe they're "evil" because God said so, and it's hard to believe that every single person that lives in a city are all the same. And today, drought and famine strike random cities with random people who are obviously all quite different. These things that we call natural disaster strike at people that happen to live where they are--it has nothing to do with whether or not they're good or evil. It's very difficult to believe any of these things were the cause of divine intervention. A tsunami doesn't happen because God willed it. It happens because of certain properties that people study in physics and geology.

To me, if God exists, he is silent and watching. If he DOES take part in earthly affairs then he doesn't do it often, or at least his efforts are unnoticed as fewer people believe.

It's also entirely possible that people want to believe that there is a God, so in effect, they have created them. Perhaps everyone believes in a God they all want to believe are the same, but maybe their versions of God are all different--but nobody can know what others think, so perhaps there are actually several different Christian Gods that people believe in--the same, and yet, not the same. People want to believe that there is someone out there that's stronger than any other human being or natural force in the universe--it comforts them that a being would protect them. So in their minds, such a being exists. Whenever, by coincidence or whatever other means, something good happens to them, they attribute it to their mysterious benefactor in their minds. And as they keep doing that, they may confuse a coincidence or event that may have happened for no reason at all for evidence of their God--it is all because of their interpretation that they think that God must exist.

It is so easy for people to confuse what they want with what actually happened. Wanting something to happen, and something actually happening in reality are two independent things. One can happen without the other and vice versa.

But there are lots of things people won't admit. It's almost funny.

 

[Doc Holliday]

God is most dispicable and vile creature in all of fiction, he wiped out the entire planet in Genesis, he killed millions of innocent people, Sodom and Gomorrah, for example.
He also inflicted mental difficulties on people, such as Abraham and Isaac, one would argue that 'no, he stopped that happening,' sure, Abraham may not have killed Isaac, but tell me, imagine living your life knowing that your father would have gladly killed you because God said so.
What about Moses, God's 'prophet,' well he's just as bad, the story of the man picking up sticks on the Sabbath, Moses ordered him to be executed for working on the sabbath.
In Leviticus, God says that a huge list of people including adulterers, homosexuals, people comitting bestiality (and the poor animal must be killed, too), people comitting incest, those who have sex during a woman's period.
He's not only dangerous, he's jealous; he'll send you to burn in all eternal hellfire for not believing in him.

Does this really sound like a benevolent, loving God?

Bullshit does it.

God is a violent, arrogant, dispicable, meglomaniacal, selfish, pestilential, evil, jealous, radically insane, jealous, hateful, disgusting, manically malevolent bully.

 

[Trextbomb]

If the christian god exists, hes an evil tyrant. The Noah's Ark story proves that.

Maybe this Satan guy is the good guy, but he never gets his time to speak cause his rival (god) has made him look bad...

 

[Ryushikaze]

Even in the bible, the worst Satan ever does is kill 8 people. And even that he did because he was told to test Job.

 

[Garner]

I don't consider God as a 'Guy'. The bible is not the word of God. He did not write the Bible, some random old man did. Christianity is a belief just like judaism, jews and etc. I am christian (though a little loose). Christianity was created because some old dude said "Oh, I believe in an all powerful being all of a sudden" and he started writing down laws and beliefs. Some just followed it, while others created new beliefs. If god exists then he can't send people to hell for not believing in him. I mean, if he were in our posistion. I doubt he'd believe it either.

I don't think he is bad or good. I don't think he even has a sex. He's a spirit... the universe? Who knows...?

 

[joeyfinalfantasygod]

I really dont think God is a bad guy but a saddist self centered S.O.B. lets see ok he created everything and he destroys it at will since the beggining of the bible how many times has God destroyed humanity starting from the ark of Noah wao we are his chess board. He is always " you have to do as i say, obey my every word if not you are so dead " Thats gods dark truth follow or be destroyed.

 

[Knight Almasy]

one word: Hypocrite. Watch Goerge Carlin on religion. Thats what i think XD.

"He gives u a list of 10things he does not want u to do. And if u so happen to do 1 of those 10 things he'll send u to a place of fire and brimstone will u scream, totured and cry 4 ever and ever until the end of time....... BUT he loves you."