People and Benefits

[Amizon]

So I heard on the radio in the car this morning that in our region, single mothers will be having their benefits cut and be forced to find a job. They will only be eligible to Jobseeker's Allowance until their child is seven, or the other way around. Not sure on that, I was only half listening.

Now I'd like a full debate about people and benefits. And when I mean benefits, I mean the unemployed people who claim them, not the ones for disabilities and health related issues.

Me personally, I'm against people having benefits if they're too lazy to get off their backsides and look for a job. Fair enough if they DO look for one, but I utterly hate the people that do the bare minimum a week or month that the job centre requires and just claim the money, such as Jobseeker's Allowance.

I know that there are hardly any jobs going in the UK right now, but to not even have the motivation to give it a look and apply for jobs is just ridiculous. In fact, I know people trying so hard to get a job right now and they keep getting turned down that it's stupid.

Thoughts on this?

 

[coffeecup]

Well...I don't know about the UK, but in the USA they try to limit people abusing the system by making the benefit payments only allowable for people who lose their jobs by a specific reason as well as impose time and amount limitations. Sure there's still going to be people who will take advantage of they system, but you're going to have that no matter what you put in place.

Plus a big reason why we have benefits in the USA goes beyond just being nice to people who gets quickly cut off by their employer, it's a measure to create a kind of buffer for the economy against massive lay-offs. I mean if you don't provide any benefits to the unemployed and there's a massive economic downturn that leads to losses of millions of jobs (ehem...), this will lead to a whole mess of crap happening that goes beyond just the consumers. It'll affect demand which will affect the suppliers and producers and banks and a bunch of other stuff. We don't want that happening now do we just because a few people will slack of when getting their unemployment benefits. Benefits outweigh the costs...so the argument goes.

 

[Bambi]

So I heard on the radio in the car this morning that in our region, single mothers will be having their benefits cut and be forced to find a job. They will only be eligible to Jobseeker's Allowance until their child is seven, or the other way around. Not sure on that, I was only half listening.

Other way round. Though why they think it's any easier to get a job when the kid is 7 is beyond me, it's not like it can suddenly look after itself. I've been actively looking for fucking ages. And if there aren't any jobs, there aren't any jobs.

I'm not sure enough single parents have enough information about getting back into work though, it's pretty daunting when it's all new to you. I've found a really reasonably priced child care for the kid, but it's out of my way, and I can't drive, so that's missions, but in my area, it is the ONLY one available for some one wanting to work full time that picks up and drops off at Ellies school. There are 2 other women, one who does 1pm - 8, the other summat like, 7 - 6.. cant remember, and she's understandably fully booked. Wouldnt surprise me if she has a waiting list either. It would help if the government made it easier for us single fucking mothers. I've been LOOKING for a job, and at one point, I was actually thinking, I could get a job, and then what, who the fuck would have her? Sorry mister employer there's NO FUCKING CHILD CARE AVAILABLE FOR ME

It's shit for those of us who are genuinely looking for work, but on the other hand, it is SO easy for me to just have stayed on benefits. I just didn't want too. I complain I'm always skint, but I can always afford new things, Im not in any debt, Im always off out for a drink/dinner.. should it really BE that easy? I don't want to scrape by, like fuck do I. reducing my benefits would cripple me, but seeing how easy I have it, I see how easy it is just to sit back and think, why should I bother? But again, try being a single mum looking for work, some days I just thought FUCK it. Why should I keep putting myself through this, it's nigh on fucking impossible to get anywhere. It's not like you can be as flexible as a 2 parent family, or single folk.

Now I'd like a full debate about people and benefits. And when I mean benefits, I mean the unemployed people who claim them, not the ones for disabilities and health related issues.

Why not? People abuse the disability benefits like you wouldnt belive, and not only that, I know a lad who is capable of working, as he so clearly does and has done for years AND lives with his parents, yet he gets disability allowance for having.. I think its epilepsy... shouldn't you just get it if you are unable to work? I'm not saying hes frauding the system, he has it, and I know he does, but why does he NEED that benefit?

Then there are just the folk, oooh bad back can't work

I think that whole part of the system needs to be looked at just as much as folk on job seekers/income support. It's easily abused (Again, he is NOT abusing the system, it's just the point of it I don't understand, I even asked him once and he was just like.. I dunno)

Me personally, I'm against people having benefits if they're too lazy to get off their backsides and look for a job. Fair enough if they DO look for one, but I utterly hate the people that do the bare minimum a week or month that the job centre requires and just claim the money, such as Jobseeker's Allowance.

I think most people share that thought, but the problem is proving it. It's easy to fill in the..I dunno what it's called - form, but they have to fill something in, to say what they have applied for and when - you can EASILY lie on those, and, you can easily just make no effort in a job interview so you don't get offered the job. I think they allow people to remain unemployed for too long, like, is it 6 months before you can be considered for some New Deal stuff, It used to be called that, couldnt tell you if it still is, but its something to do with getting folk back into work anyway.... it needs tightening up. Alot.

But with the current situation, and how many folk are unemployed I imagine it's much harder to keep track of the folk who don't want to work, and it's easier for them to say they cant find work

And again, going back to disability/mental health issues, it's an excuse that can be used

I know that there are hardly any jobs going in the UK right now, but to not even have the motivation to give it a look and apply for jobs is just ridiculous. In fact, I know people trying so hard to get a job right now and they keep getting turned down that it's stupid.

What REALLY gets my goat, is folk that HAVE jobs, but just fuck them off because they can't be arsed. It's like, there are folk desperate for work and you've just acted the prat and left/got yourself fired becauase you are an utter lazy/stupid cunt?

My ex is a prime example, he's been in and out of jobs so many times over the years, he had a good job with brtish gas, just stopped going one day, and one with Orange after that, and again, just stopped going, he's been unemployed forrrrrrr, over a year or so now, Im sure, and he's just taking the piss. He's a job shy cunt yet Im the one breaking my neck left holding the baby, willing and looking for work and all he wants to do is be a lazy fucking bastard and do nothing when I would give my left testicle to have a job

Thems the folks that really make me sick.

My brain has worked too hard today

 

[Sum1sgruj]

Forever trust in who you are, because when it comes down to it,, the brass tax we are forced to pay is enforced by the scrutiny we face everyday. we are ensured tomorrow by yesterdays inquiry. Such is life,, that we will be guarenteed by tomorrows regret//

 

[Channizard]

...^ wut

nothing when I would give my left testicle to have a job

I knew it. And now I have proof.

In Canada it's not too hard/our benefit system isn't bad. You can apply online and.. well actually do everything online and not have to worry about it. It's actually really easy to forge. They ask you a series of questions, whether you were able to work, whether or not you collected funds an shit.. and then they'll just give you your money in your account every 2 weeks.. or shortly after you file your report.

There's actually no proof required, they mainly concern themselves with other funds you received. If you have, then they deduct that from the benefits you'll get from the government and that's it.. but they don't ask if you've been to any interviews or were out actively looking for a job. It's actually really slack now that I think about it.

As far as I know there's a time limit though. Paternity/Medical benefits have a limit of 15 weeks I believe, by then you should be ready to go back to work. But after that's up, I'm pretty sure you can just apply for regular unemployment benefits. But the regular benefits lasts for maybe a year and then your claim closes.. and then maybe you can apply for a new claim? I'm not sure, I was only on it for a couple months.

The money itself is pretty good, about 55% of your last recorded wage job, so if you had a good job you can get decent benefits then.

As far as this UK shit is, that's crap. D= But anywhere you go there can, and will be people who will abuse the benefits program. >.<

....all my opinions may or may not be invalid because I may or may not live in Canada as what's not discussed.

Mostly may

 

[Sum1sgruj]

America is the one to face the recession now, but others have felt it,, and before its over, everyone will know wht it is to struggle, for the rich and poor,, Whatever you may depened on will come to light,, and people will know what it is to be alone

Welcome to real life. Where the dog eats the wolf and th cat kills the dog

 

[coffeecup]

Forever trust in who you are, because when it comes down to it,, the brass tax we are forced to pay is enforced by the scrutiny we face everyday. we are ensured tomorrow by yesterdays inquiry. Such is life,, that we will be guarenteed by tomorrows regret//

America is the one to face the recession now, but others have felt it,, and before its over, everyone will know wht it is to struggle, for the rich and poor,, Whatever you may depened on will come to light,, and people will know what it is to be alone

...what the hell does this have to do with benefits? I can't tell if what you're saying is brilliant or purposefully ambiguous as to detract from the fact that you really have no point. Or maybe you're the Riddler?

In other words, could you please talk straight, because I think you might have something good to contribute to the discussion...but it's not going to hit home if you make it impossible to understand.

 

[Sum1sgruj]

The Riddler

No, I'm simply stating that 'benefits' are only manifestations of past argument. What is to become of tomorrow? Do you have any depth at all??

 

[coffeecup]

The Riddler

No, I'm simply stating that 'benefits' are only manifestations of past argument. What is to become of tomorrow? Do you have any depth at all??

Guess not because I still have no clue what you're saying. I have my reservations on what you're trying to do or represent. I'll just pretend I understand what you mean, and leave it at that. Carry on.

Edit: So as to not totally derail the thread.
This thread reminds me of the Seinfeld episode where George tries to keep his unemployment checks rolling in. He actually works harder at meeting the requirements than he does on actual employment. I think OP would enjoy this episode

 

[Valvalis]

Me personally, I'm against people having benefits if they're too lazy to get off their backsides and look for a job. Fair enough if they DO look for one, but I utterly hate the people that do the bare minimum a week or month that the job centre requires and just claim the money, such as Jobseeker's Allowance.

I agree with this, it is a shame when people take advantage. However, if I were in the situation of needing the help, I think it would probably be hard for me to say anything bad about these types of programs. I think the problem is just that there's this huge matter of placing blame on why someone was laid off, and trying to decide who's responsible for the compensation--if you trace the blame back to the company CEO, that traces back to consumers spending less money on the company's products, which itself traces back to the consumers making less money at their own jobs, and it's just a huge complicated cyclical mess. Really it's a good population control lesson on all the previous civilizations and historical periods; I would that we could go back in time and send them a huge snapshot of what's going on now, with the subtitle "Thanks for nothing, f*ckers " I think really the only way to solve anything like this is through individuals lessening our resource consumption in general, to prolong what we have left for as long as possible, since wealth essentially boils down to simple necessary physical materials in the end. Or, there're always pitchforks and torches :dave: ...So long as we still have enough metal and wood, anyway

 

[Sum1sgruj]

If you got up at the crackass and footed 20 miles.. you would still have the same job status as the next person. There is nothing you can say to prove that otherwise..

 

[blakstang98]

Okay Sum1, enough with the psychodelic talk. I can twist my mind and make some sense of it, but nobody really understands. If you have a point to make, then start making sense.

In the US, this has been a heavy debate topic for a long time. People like single parents could use a little government help to make ends meet. But on that same token, some will take full advantage of this and just not work until the time period is over for free money.

Personally, I don't like the idea of welfare. My condolences to those that could use the extra help, but I fully believe that there are more of the type to just abuse the system. This essentially forces people to get off their asses and get a job. Being a tax payer, I know I don't feel good that I'm supporting people who refuse to get a job because they get free money from tax payers. Here in the US, I believe they support a person for 2 years after they have their first kid, then they're cut off. At some point, they weren't cut off after the first kid, but the last, which meant they just kept having kids to milk the system. Thankfully that's not the case anymore.