Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi Official Teaser trailer *SPOILERS*

Rey

Rey

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Discuss/Speculate!
 
This teaser seems to support a number of theories which people had about The Last Jedi.

I know that Pablo Hidalgo recently seemed to deny the existence of Grey Jedi in the main Star Wars films, but that doesn't mean that Hidalgo was denying that there are Force users who deal with a balanced version of the Force. This trailer seems to suggest that Luke has an appreciation of the balance, and that he thinks that the Jedi should end (possibly because the Jedi vs Sith dichotomy is too simplistic and creates extremes?).

This does look interesting. I love the shot on the planet where the starships are disturbing the red dust underneath the dry, white, crusty soil (or salt, or whatever?).
 
Dionysos said:
This teaser seems to support a number of theories which people had about The Last Jedi.

I know that Pablo Hidalgo recently seemed to deny the existence of Grey Jedi in the main Star Wars films, but that doesn't mean that Hidalgo was denying that there are Force users who deal with a balanced version of the Force. This trailer seems to suggest that Luke has an appreciation of the balance, and that he thinks that the Jedi should end (possibly because the Jedi vs Sith dichotomy is too simplistic and creates extremes?).

This does look interesting. I love the shot on the planet where the starships are disturbing the red dust underneath the dry, white, crusty soil (or salt, or whatever?).
Click to expand...
I'm kind of thinking that Luke is goina about it in a different way. That he thinks the Jedi should disappear all together from the universe. Think about it he was the last one to become a Jedi in VI, then saw the rise of it again sometime between VII only to see probably his first pupil turn dark. So he may think it's time for the Jedi to stop being the police of the galaxy and just fade away completely.
 
I was worried at first to watch it in case it spoiled too much as most trailers do these days. Suprisingly didnt and of course I wanted more. They just cant win either way win it comes to trailers. Still excited though.
 
Oh, no official thread has been created so looks like I am putting my thoughts here. I want to start by saying that I do understand not everyone is going to love this movie and not everyone is going to support the story direction they went in. There will absolutely be MAJOR SPOILERS below so if you didn't watch it then dont read anything. I finally saw it recently and my hype was through the roof at the beginning of the film and at the end it did kind of shoot down from being incredible. I have my reasons and this is still one of the top Star Wars movies ever mad FOR ME but I have criticims about a lot of things in this movie. I did think it was great and in fact my final rating is an 8.5/10 for it! Anyway, let's get into the major spoilers of the movie and juicy bits which I will then follow up with theories for IX because I left the theatre with expectations that IX might be mediocre.

Thoughts on first act of The Last Jedi:
It opens with Poe flying his ship into trying to mock the First Order's leader, General Hux with some pretty awful jokes. I thought the acting was extremely terrible in the opening scene but then it cuts to Rey and Luke on Ach-Too which are some of my favourite parts of the movie for many reasons. The interaction between them really does make the movie. Luke's unwillingness to train Rey at first shows he's willing to give up the Jedi and the order even though Rey keeps on pushing him to help the Resistance. It is only then when Rey sees the official ancient Jedi Texts where Luke finally notices not just anyone has come to see him. He realizes there must be more to it and decides to train her. I think this was phenomenally done and although Rey only gets 3 lessons, it's a nice throwback to TESB where Luke learned to resist the darkness and what he was afraid of which was ultimately himself. Interestingly, Rey tries to tell Luke that the force only moves things and he berates her with the real lessons and shows her if she can resist the force. He then explains that Rey's leaning towards the dark side like Ren which I thought was very interesting because Rey is shown to be extremely vulnerable in the movie and i'll explain how later on. Next, Rey uses her lightsaber and Luke is incredibly shocked how proficient she is with the blade. Now, that's odd is it not? Rey is damn powerful and even later on knocks Luke to the ground...Luke motherfucking Skywalker... yep.

An amazing thing they added in the film was new force abilities but before that let me get to a scene that ultimately the fans really hate and that is Leia's fake death plus survival with the force. Okay, so we know Carrie Fisher finished filming this movie before she died and that Leia is Luke's sister by blood so she is FORCE SENSITIVE. My theatre had people screaming what the hell and i'm guessing those people aren't real Star Wars fans as back in Return of the Jedi, Luke DID TELL HER she'll get to use that power she has. It didn't bother me whatsoever because of those simple reasons but apparently women being too strong is a running thing people are criticizing in the movie. I guess Leia technically SHOULD have died but that would disrespect both Carrie Fisher and the character. Leia using the force does NOT DISRESPECT her in any way like people think.

Next, I want to talk about the first throne room scene and our introduction to Supreme Leader Snoke who took Hux with the force by Hologram after he failed to destroy Poe. The first throne room scene is incredibly intense because Snoke is crazy evil and I felt it at the theatre in my bones. The acting is very good and the way he shocks ren with Lightning is really cool. Obviously, the point of this scene is that Ren failed to kill Rey and now to prove to Snoke, Ren must capture and kill her before his master. More on that in act 2.... Overall, the first act is great but the introduction to Rose does sort of remove Finn's importance of waking up from his injury and I do feel that Finn was nothing in this movie and had by far the most pointless scenes. Rose in act 1 felt too kawaii love story kind of thing because she shocks Finn for being a traitor but still follows him absolutely everywhere and it breaks the bromance that Poe and Finn have and leaves Rey out of this love triangle because she is training on the island.

Skype calls with the force:
This new force ability although not new but seemingly perfected is my favourite part of the movie. Rey and Ren communicate their weaknesses and fears towards eachother and seemingly have feelings for eachother throughout. It's a great story telling technique to give both characters the screen time they deserve. By communicating with eachother, it is revealed that Kylo is insanely lonely and couldnt even kill his mother or even hate his father Han solo after stabbing him in Episode VII. Rey, in contrast is also very lonely and strong with the dark side of the force but she learns to resist Kylo and in turn wants to save him because she sees "good" in him or the light side of the force. These scenes made me like Kylo Ren so much more because we find out a lot about him which was severely lacking in VII because all he did was kill people and there was not enough talking (story). These scenes are powerful and made me peek into the minds of both characters very often. Act I ends and we enter Act II which is strong but largely pointless in some aspects.

Act II/Canto Blight:
Canto Blight is the most pointless thing in the movie even though it gives us some background on Rose who is largely very unimportant at this point in the film and only follows Finn because her sister died. We learn that the rich aliens of Canto Blight hold slaves and sell weapons to the first order but the damn movie spends ages trying to find a codebreaker which Maz tells Rose and Finn about. We never find out about why Maz is in trouble and shooting people though because the casino scene that follows is more important apparently. I have bad things to say about this whole sequence. It went on for too long and is incosistent. There are too many filler scenes and Finn looking at pretty women that it becomes quite the joke of the movie. After a couple of minutes of a snoozefest, Rose and Finn finally find the codebreaker and are arrested by FO guards and are thrown in a jail cell. They find a thug there who is a codebreaker and proves it to them by unlocking every cell. WHY DIDN'T HE BREAK OUT BEFORE ROSE AND FINN ARRIVED? This ends up going on too long. Ah yes, the whole Rey parents debate is about to come to an end.... wait for it wait for it... she falls into the dark hole on Ach-Too and sees a vision of thousands of clones of herself in single file. This is yet another reference to Dagoba in V. The mirror clears and her parents are seemingly nobody but drunk scrap people. REALLY? Next, Rey in a rainy scene on the island with Luke. She ends up finding out the truth about what happened because Kylo told her she should seek the truth by asking Luke himself. Luke tried to kill Ren by striking him down one night in bed when he saw iredeemable darkness in him but Kylo didnt make his decision to turn yet and is thus betrayed by his master. Rey is angered and strikes Luke down almost trying to kill him by telling him if he really tried to kill him afterwards. Luke is not evil and instead failed Ren and decided to stop training Jedi for good. A cool nod to episode IX and the Knights of Ren soon follows because we learn Kylo abducted former Luke apprentices and slaughtered the rest in the temple. More on that in the speculation section.

Poe and Holdo:
Holdo takes the place of Leia after she is hit by missles and uses the force to survive after Kylo couldnt press the button to kill her himself. Holdo was a character with lots of potential but she dies in act III killing herself for a noble cause. I dont have much to say on this new character other than I'm pretty disappointed she was just going to die. She's just a symbol of hope much like the ending of the movie and I wish she was a sith lord instead. Who even knew you can lightspeed into a ship and cut through the whole damn thing?

Act III:
Driven by her determination to help Ren, Rey leaves Luke on the island and volunteers to give herself to Ren. Things get very interesting here including a jump to a force ghost of Yoda where an angered Luke tries to burn down the Jedi tree only for Yoda to burn it. This Yoda cameo made me extremely happy since he is my favourite star wars character! Who else could set Luke straight besides his master? That scene begins the journey into the best act of the film in which Luke now has a cause to fight for. I have a lot to say about Act III because things happen too quickly. First of all, the next and final throne room scene is probably one of the best parts of the movie even though shite literally goes down. In a very important scene, Rey turns herself in to Kylo and he takes her to Snoke. Snoke begins to lecture Rey about how he breached their minds to communicate by the force in an effort to kill Luke and then tortures Rey as a test to see the hatred in her as he saw her grab Kylo's saber. Snoke proceeds to tell Kylo to kill Rey to fulfill his destiny (something Sideous would say... snoke is obviously Plagueis guiz) but he is betrayed by Ren who uses the force to ignite Rey's lightsaber which cuts Snoke in two. The most shocking scene in the theatre because he's a new character with wasted potential. This really bothered me but the scenes that follow are beautiful. A lightsaber fight emerges between the Praetorian guards and Rey+Ren who have seemingly allied.... Kylo never uses the force her despite killing Snoke with it! After the guards die... Ren tells Rey to join him and kill everything in the past. Kill Luke, kill the truth about her parents, the resistance, and even Snoke. She hesitates because she is alone and tells Ren she's shocked he would still do this after everything he's been through. The shocking reveal is that Ren is the ultimate evil and Snoke is dead. They do not join one another and instead using the force shatters her lightsaber in two. In all honesty I was very shocked it ended up like this but I do feel Snoke isn't dead. Oh yeah there's a confrontation between Hux and Ren about the Supreme leader position and Ren chokes him. Some insignificant crap happens after that like that one character gets back in the dump again......

The Empire Strikes back 2.0
The last part of Act III ends on Crait in a gruesome battle which resembles Hoth in Episode V. Holdo is revealed to have killed herself by lightspeeding into Snoke's ship and cleared a path for the resistance in a jaw dropping seen. Afterwards, the finale begins and Rey is revealed to have taken the jedi texts with her onto the Milennium Falcon. The battle is very reminiscent of Hoth because of the two sides. One side has the first order firing at the Rebel base and the other side is relatively hopeless. Luke arrives on Crait and meets Leia who is very shocked by the number of people she has lost until she sees him. In a very emotional scene, Luke touches and kisses Leia's forehead and she responds with I know what you're gonna say "you changed your hair" and gives her Han's Dice form the OT. Eventually, he arrives on the battlefield to confront Ren after telling Leia it's not possible to turn her son back. Finn tries to perform a heroic sacrafice but is blocked by Rose who is left unconcious after giving Finn a kiss where she clearly didnt want to miss. This part is very very awkward because the AT AT'S are performing concentrated fire on Luke who is revealed to have gotten to Crait somehow which greatly angers Ren. One man is being fired upon but they somehow safely get back to base.... across a battlefield of murder. Yup.... and the final battle between Luke and Ren commences. Luke shrugs off the concentrated fire in a rather humourous way and Ren is deeply angered after berates him by telling him the man is dead. Ren is full of immense grimace and seemingly kills Luke only for Luke to survive and lecture him. Kylo notices Luke's saber doesnt interact with the salt and gets angry that Luke isn't there physically. Luke is revealed to have been on Ach-To using the force in the same way Rey does but he projects himself across the galaxy annd the legend comes to an end. Luke Skywalker DIES. When you think about it, it's a very heroic death and is a reference to Ben's s suicide in episode IV. The movie ends with Rey back at the falcon comforting Leia about the losses the resistance has only to flip to Canto Bight where we see a kid who pulls the broom with the force gazing at a spark of hope for the resistance while showing he is part of the resistance. The movie ends and seemingly anyone can be a jedi now.

Problems with VIII
The major problem with VIII is that some characters have been wittled down into a stupid subplot. This new romance triangle removes anything significant from Finn and literally all he does in this film is loot a casino for a codebreaker and kills Phasma (who I didnt even mention because her screentime in this movie is stupid low) Once he kills Phasma, there is nothing left for him to do and he becomes so insignificant for Episode IX since his whole plot was to kill Phasma as the rebel scum he is and that's exactly what happens.

Rose removed too much of the plot and stole it and she's very uninteresting. Her sister dies in the beginning and she goes from engineer to somehow loving Finn in the space of 2 hours. We could have had big boy Finn doing more at the resistance if it weren't for that whole stupid Canto Bight sequence.

PHASMA WAS SHITE PHASMA WAS SHITE. Seriously, she's a joke character at this point because she's dumped into the trash in seconds and it's seriously stupid at this point. I have no faith in anyone delivering on Phasma for episode IX and I seriously hope the stupid character stays fucking dead.

The codebreaker DJ never broke himself out of prison until he had the reward. What a stupid pointless scene!!!

Why didn't Holdo tell Poe her plan RIGHT AWAY? Another stupid plot point and possibly plot hole.

The jokes are stupid, and the film writes a joke in itself when we never find out how the first order acquired tech to follow ships through lightspeed which makes the codebreaker plot fucking worthless.

How did Rose and Finn survive a murderfield? Concentrated fire on Luke didn't last an hour......

Kylo uses the force to kill Snoke but can't use the force against guards? WTF

How the hell are they communicating at the end if Snoke breached their minds to do that?



EPISODE IX SPECULATION:

Plagueis theory: There is no big bad for episode IX and it cannot be Kylo Ren so at the end of The Last Jedi, I theorized that Snoke will come back and isn't really dead for these reasons: He looks different in hologram form, he knows Vader, Plagueis is cabaple of reviving people and inhabiting bodies, etc. He could simply be an illusion as well because this movie brought many force powers to the mix and anything is possible at this point. Indeed, Kylo Ren is supreme leader of the first order at the end of The Last Jedi but he's still very vulnerable and I do believe my theory is plausible because Snoke cant be a new character if he knows of Vader and told Ren to smash his helmet much like how we saw the burned vader helmet in VII. Could that have been an Illusion? Could Snoke be alive since Kylo and Rey still communicate after his death?

The Knights of Ren:
In the Last Jedi, it is revealed that Ren took some of Luke's students for himself and destroyed the Jedi Temple. I believe that these will be the Knights of Ren referenced in VII because Ren needs men by his side. General Hux is evil but he has no force powers or anything significant now that Ren is supreme leader.

Rey and Ren alliance? My least likely theory here but in the movie it was revealed that Rey does lean towards the dark and is more or less a grey force warrior but is still incredibly vulnerable. The problem IX is facing is Rey vs Ren since everyone else of value is dead or unimportant. It would make a boring episode and I fully believe Snoke will be back to thwart the plans of Rey and maybe even Ren now that he was betrayed. Rey has NO parents unless Kylo isn't telling the truth and simply manipulated her to join him. Luke says in this film that it wont go the way you think it will. It's very interesting to think about.

VIII's ending may surely indicate a
timeskip because there is no way Force boy wont be a major character at this point. They have the anyone can be a jedi theme so I somewhat expect a timeskip to happen for Kylo Ren to settle down and rule with his Knights.

VIII feels like the ending more than a cliffhangar episode and that's going to prove that we can't have a boring Rey vs Ren confrontation. Rey took the Jedi texts with her and it's possible she'll learn a lot more about what the force entails and maybe even the dark and light. She'll become an official grey user of the force which proves why she's so damn overpowered.

We will have to wait until the first trailer for IX launches but hopefully some deleted scenes will help us understand some important ambiguous scenes. The movie was over 3 hours and was cut down to 2 hours and a half after all. Until then, I loved VIII despite big problems and i'm happy to call it better than VII and the prequels. It still doesnt stand up to A new hope or the titans known as V and VI though.
 
Rey said:
Rey and Ren alliance? My least likely theory here but in the movie it was revealed that Rey does lean towards the dark and is more or less a grey force warrior but is still incredibly vulnerable. The problem IX is facing is Rey vs Ren since everyone else of value is dead or unimportant. It would make a boring episode and I fully believe Snoke will be back to thwart the plans of Rey and maybe even Ren now that he was betrayed. Rey has NO parents unless Kylo isn't telling the truth and simply manipulated her to join him. Luke says in this film that it wont go the way you think it will. It's very interesting to think about.
Click to expand...
Sorry, but I don't think "Rey leans towards the dark" is true at all.

First of all, you have to understand that in the "pit of darkness", Rey communicated directly with the dark side. I don't see much talk about this part in your post, but the reason why she went into the pit is because above all she was determined to find out who her parents were, and the dark side seduced her with this info. When the dark side answered and said it did not know (because her parents were nobodies, not Force sensitive in any way), she rejects the dark side.

Why is she able to reject the dark side so easily, when countless fully-trained Jedi have fallen throughout the millennia? Because the Force is all about balance. The concept of balance is something the Jedi Order failed to understand, and it's why they fell. They believed that destroying the Sith would create balance (Anakin was destined to create balance -> "You were supposed to destroy the Sith, not join them!" -> ended up creating balance by destroying the Sith only once the Light side had sufficiently weakened), but balance is an equilibrium between light and dark.

Luke once again failed to learn this lesson when he created his new Jedi Academy. When he saw the dark in Ben Solo and feared it enough to consider destroying him, his own nephew, it empowered the dark side. Kylo Ren became a very powerful Dark Side user, and to combat this, the Light side created equal raw power for the Light in Rey.

If there was ever to be an alliance between Rey and Ren, it would be because they finally managed to learn the lesson that millennia of Jedi and Sith have failed to understand; balance is not achieved by one side destroying the other. I could see Rey and Ren training a new generation of Grey Jedi, Jedi that understand that outright rejecting the Dark only leads to an upset of the balance in favour of the Light.

While I disagree with a lot of choices made by Rian Johnson when directing the movie, evolving the Jedi Order / Sith Empire in this way is not one of them. There's always literal tonnes of past lore to draw on if they ever want to create "old-school" Star Wars stories (REVAN MOVIE TRILOGY WHEN!?).

My main problem with this movie is that I felt it focused so much on character development, it felt like this movie did not need to be a Star Wars movie. I felt like there were so few "direct" scenes that literally could not happen outside of the Star Wars universe, everything was sub-text and everyone learning life lessons to fall into their roles.

The only part of the movie I felt was better than VII was
Rey & Ren vs the Elite Praetorian Guard
. That part was cooler than the surface of Pluto.
 
Belazor et Britannia said:
Sorry, but I don't think "Rey leans towards the dark" is true at all.

First of all, you have to understand that in the "pit of darkness", Rey communicated directly with the dark side. I don't see much talk about this part in your post, but the reason why she went into the pit is because above all she was determined to find out who her parents were, and the dark side seduced her with this info. When the dark side answered and said it did not know (because her parents were nobodies, not Force sensitive in any way), she rejects the dark side.

Why is she able to reject the dark side so easily, when countless fully-trained Jedi have fallen throughout the millennia? Because the Force is all about balance. The concept of balance is something the Jedi Order failed to understand, and it's why they fell. They believed that destroying the Sith would create balance (Anakin was destined to create balance -> "You were supposed to destroy the Sith, not join them!" -> ended up creating balance by destroying the Sith only once the Light side had sufficiently weakened), but balance is an equilibrium between light and dark.
. That part was cooler than the surface of Pluto.
Click to expand...

Rey isn't full light and that's what I was trying to explain. She's vulnerable but not as much as Kylo Ren. She's vulnerable though and you can see that in this movie during the force calls, and also when Luke tries to teach her about the force. I know she's not 100% LEANING towards the dark side but she's a grey warrior and is extremely powerful. She without a doubt isn't full light but she's hesitant once Kylo tells her to form an alliance but she resists it because of the lessons from Luke and the dark hole. That being said, she's overpowered but still has a lot to learn which is why she took the ancient Jedi texts for herself to read. Rey learned from the cave that she's her own master even without parents, much like Kylo Ren is his own master and doesn't need Snoke or Luke even though Luke teaches him at the end of the film that he can never let go of him.

I feel that the alliance thing was just a sub thought of mine and I dont really rank it high on a list of possibilities but you do know Episode IX has a big plot problem and is now pretty much down to Rey vs Ren... boring. This movie taught me that anything can change easily, including the identity of Rey's parents probably being a way to seduce Rey into joining Ren. Right now it almost feels like a cop out but in IX it could change.
 
My point was; I think the point of the movie and the title is that the idea of Jedi and Sith, one being full Light and the other being full Dark, should be abolished. At least that's what I gather from some of the arguments from polarised fans; some wanting the traditional light/dark dichotomy to stay, and some who think seeing it go is the way to move the franchise forward. That's also why I mentioned it's always possible to go back in time and make movies out of the metric tonnes of lore, if it turns out fans reject this new dichotomy once IX is released.

So when you said she was leaning towards the Dark, I felt I should chime in and say that while she was created by the Light in order to create a balance towards Ren's Dark, I believe IX could be titled something like "The Force In Balance", and it ending with either both of them working together to create Grey Jedi going forwards. Either they would both mellow out to the other side so they both turn grey, or Rey being the Light side teacher while Ren is the Dark side teacher.
 
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