Proof God does not exist

Rockman X

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#42
And yes I don't make sense in my posts because I am very bad at grammar and religion history.
I gathered.

prior to the big bang, assuming the theory is correct, the laws of physics dont apply, so what it was really like is impossible to know
Your saying it's impossible to know just voided what you said in your last post and it makes speculation on the matter completely pointless :monster: Not to mention it has absolutely no pertinence to the dilemma of what one would do if they found a box proving God did not exist.
 

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#43
I remember in grade 3 I was discussing about how was God created with my friends. Some suggested the meteors gather together and the spirit from another world gave him power to make life. I suggested the stars connected him. My friend Adrian moronically says he's a broom.
I wonder if that's true.
 

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#44
remember in grade 3 I was discussing about how was God created with my friends. Some suggested the meteors gather together and the spirit from another world gave him power to make life
according to the bible, god always existed, and god created the world.

My friend Adrian moronically says he's a broom
thats not much less moronic than god being god and jesus/messiah and the holy ghost.

the title of the thread says proof god doesnt exist, does the box also work for polytheistic religions?
 

Rockman X

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#45
according to the bible, god always existed, and god created the world.
Yep. Plus, that's kind of how deities work. They're generally higher life forms that have been around forever and do the creating.

thats not much less moronic than god being god and jesus/messiah and the holy ghost.
I've heard Christians explain God like an egg before. Like God the Father is the egg shell, Jesus is the white, and the Holy Ghost is the yolk. Kinda sad that they have to liken God to an egg to explain the Trinity.

the title of the thread says proof god doesnt exist, does the box also work for polytheistic religions?
I would assume so. And if that were the case, it'd render almost every religion false.
 

RioDragon

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#46
This is a tough question... Especially considering that I see no way that ONE item or maybe even a million items, would disprove the existence of god. No matter how many arguments there are that there isn't a god, there are always one or more rebuttles that there is...

Seeing as that is the case, I'd just do whatever and it wouldn't make a bit of difference in any way.
 

Dagolu

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#47
I'd take the box and find a way to extract God's power from it.
But since that isn't an answer, I'd probably destroy the box, not because I'm religous, but because I know that people need religion in their lives. they need something to believe in and not know or understand.

so new question, prove to me that I didn't create the universe at 7:41 EST this morning.
 

Rockman X

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#48
This is a tough question... Especially considering that I see no way that ONE item or maybe even a million items, would disprove the existence of god. No matter how many arguments there are that there isn't a god, there are always one or more rebuttles that there is...
Doesn't matter that you don't see it, in the question posed the box contains undeniable proof. You'd know God wasn't real the second you opened the box.

However, you're right about there being arguments to it. Alot of people would discount it. After all, if Christians can claim that fossils were planted in the ground by the devil, they could discount evidence that proved God wasn't real either.

But since that isn't an answer, I'd probably destroy the box, not because I'm religous, but because I know that people need religion in their lives. they need something to believe in and not know or understand.
There's always religions without deities, or science. Or it would just be a good opportunity for people to learn to think for themselves.

so new question, prove to me that I didn't create the universe at 7:41 EST this morning.
Because I'm 20 years old, I was around long before 7:41 this morning. Dumb question, we're not doing it, we're sticking to the original question posed in this thread.
 

Dagolu

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#49
Because I'm 20 years old, I was around long before 7:41 this morning. Dumb question, we're not doing it, we're sticking to the original question posed in this thread.
yes, but who's to say that I didn't create your memories? To make you think that you are twenty years old

but back on topic, almost all religions (that survive) are based on good natured gods/god.
and a society that doesn't believe in a god eventually believes in luck, fate or other factors that reassure us that we have purpose
 
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Hera Ledro

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#50
Um, not to sound insolent or anything, but do you realize that very few gods from currently existing religions are actually "good natured?"

Let's start off with YHWH, possibly the most well-known in all societies. He is probably one of the more barbaric and hypocritical gods out there. He preaches mercy, but then tells the Jews who came from the Exodus into the Promised Land "the women and children you shall take for your own," implying rape and slavery, and "You shall slaughter all the men." Oh yeah, amazing mercy there, mmhmmm. Really good-natured.

He also, to use the absolute most basic example, brought misery into existence. Alright, I'm all for having yin and yang, opposing forces that require each other to exist and all that, but honestly, the amount of suffering in existence today is appalling. Why wouldn't he help those people who really need it, and say "Fuck you" to all the people prayng to win the lottery, hmm?

Hindu gods can be considered to be just as barbaric as Christian/Jewish/Islam YHWH. Hellloooo, the caste system? That's pretty much bullshit, in my opinion, and the fact that, until Ghandi, the "Untouchable caste" was quite literally untouchable and looked down upon severely, is total crap. I'm sure that Brahman (sp?) was extremely good-natured to let that carry on, yeah.

I could go on, but there's enough for you to chew on here for now, Dagolu. I can say without a doubt in my mind that most existing religions today, like 99% most, are NOT based on good-natured gods, but gods that blind their people to their wrongs and make it seem like they are good natured. YHWH didn't have to send the plagues, Shiva doesn't have to destroy and recreate the universe, as well as many other examples don't have to do what they do/are supposed to do.
 

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#51
I'd surmise that the reason these Gods are responsible for disasters and bad things is because that's the kind of explanation people without science wanted to give natural phenomena. The only problem with this is that by suggesting that the Gods did this and blamed it all on people, you also must concede that morality was involved, and instead of using a simplistic, natural explanation for why "disaster" happens, you now get to blame a possibly made up God who makes himself oblivious to blame by making other people blame themselves for it, when it has no basis whatsoever. This also ties into the fact that people without science also made the fallacious assumption that we would never grow smart enough to use science to discover what they could not--it's almost like playing a game of hide the candy.

Yes, it's true that humanity bites itself in the ass, but never, ever underestimate its ability in intelligence. The fact that we have emotions and the ability to understand such things as advanced calculus and quantum physics all rolled up into humanity amuses me to no end.
 

Rockman X

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#52
yes, but who's to say that I didn't create your memories? To make you think that you are twenty years old
That's the dumbest hypothetical question I've ever heard.

Let's start off with YHWH, possibly the most well-known in all societies. He is probably one of the more barbaric and hypocritical gods out there. He preaches mercy, but then tells the Jews who came from the Exodus into the Promised Land "the women and children you shall take for your own," implying rape and slavery, and "You shall slaughter all the men." Oh yeah, amazing mercy there, mmhmmm. Really good-natured.

He also, to use the absolute most basic example, brought misery into existence. Alright, I'm all for having yin and yang, opposing forces that require each other to exist and all that, but honestly, the amount of suffering in existence today is appalling. Why wouldn't he help those people who really need it, and say "Fuck you" to all the people prayng to win the lottery, hmm?
I actually have another lovely example for this. My mom is a 1337 Jesus-freak, and last night I got into a little debate with her.

In the Old Testament, Yahweh required blood sacrifices (animals) for the Israelites to be saved. In the New Testament, the coming of his son Jesus Christ changed those rules. In John 14:6, Jesus states "I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father except through me." He payed for humanity's sins and is now the way into heaven, provided one accepts him as their savior. The Bible (and especially Jesus) also depicts the Father as a merciful, just and fair god.

Now, here is the example I gave my mother, it's applicable today and was even more applicable 2000 years ago: lets say there's a remote village, maybe in the Himalayas, and nobody can get there to tell these people about the Jewish god or Jesus. They're ignorant of the gospel but it's no fault of their own. There are two things that can happen when they die.

1. God sends them to Hell, and is therefore unfair, unjust and merciless
2. God decides to be fair and lets them into heaven, thus rendering what Jesus said ("no one" comes to the father...) false

Well, once I'd posed that to my mother she basically floundered. At first she said that people will know there's a God because of Creation (i.e. this world, they'll see it and say to themselves that something out there had to make it). However, I told her that revelation doesn't necessarily mean the idea of god they'll form will be the Jewish god. She also told me that upon realizing that there's a god, people realize they have a need to be saved from sin...which is bull. Even if somehow they were to think of that, they still wouldn't know of Jesus and would likely come to the conclusion that being a good person gets you saved.

So she rambled on a bit more, and eventually ended with saying how God would let them into heaven, to which I said "So he's making them exceptions then? That makes what Jesus said false." She stumbled at that, then said that it wasn't an exception and that I'd just have to read the Bible so that God could speak to me and I could understand it, because us trying to understand him was like an ant trying to understand a person. So basically she just proved what Jesus said to be false, there are other ways into heaven.
 
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#53
I'm an Atheist, but if I found that box I'd destroy it. I'd hate to think where the world would go to if people found out their faith is a fraud.

Plus I'm not one to crush dreams, I myself know when I croak, I die and that's it, no heaven or hell. But when people talk about seeing their loved ones "in the next life" I don't belittle it, its a good thought to hold onto.

On second thought, I'd eat the box, I can honestly say it would never be seen again.
 

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#54
Destroy it. It is basically a copy of pandoras box. More bad would come from it than good. Wars would start over control of the box, millions would die just for proof that it exists, studies would be carried out, Catholics would be right.....Maybe the first 2 things arent all that bad, but i couldnt bear to let that bastard Benedict win.
 
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#55
Personally, I wouldn't destroy it, but I wouldn't show it to anyone. I mean, for a start, who's to say you could destroy it?

I wouldn't want to hurt so many people that I've come to know, just to show the world that God doesn't exist. Personally, that knowledge would get me nowhere in life. It might mean I'd also get nowhere in death, but meh, I'm not entirely bothered if there is no afterlife (not my view, but who am I to argue?).

A lot of the people in my life believe in God, and to show them this box would hurt them too much to justify it. Yes, it would stop a lot of arguments, but somehow I feel that proof that God doesn't exist would vary from person to person, rather than be one particular thing. What may seem like unargueable proof to one person (the big bang theory being a fairly major one to some scientists), it means absolutely nothing to someone else. But obviously that's getting off topic.

Like I said, I wouldn't destroy it for fear of mistake (and doubts afterwards), but I wouldn't show it.
 
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#56
I would love to show it to the whole world if such thing exist. Yeah, it will hurt lots of people, emotionally, but don't we experience that once in a while? In such occasion, we stumble but the good part of it is we stand up and learn something from it. The sad part of it is that some of this people fail to "stand up" and do something crazy either to oneself or to others.

Truth hurts. It's a fact. People should go out of that place called wonderland and face the real world.
 
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#57
Wow, a really interesting question.

Although I am an Atheist, I would destroy the box without question. Hell, I wouldn't even look in it. Everyone holds their own beliefs because those beliefs support them as much as they support their own beliefs. Many people follow a certain religion for guidance and comfort, and to show the box to the world and rip them of what keeps their heads leveled is just terrible. I think the only people that would show the box are people who have some sort of crazed power complex, or just an adamant Atheist.

Sometimes, you have to sacrifice the truth for greater things. It just wouldn't be right to wreck SO many lives.
 

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#58
I agree. Religion is a way to find ones own salvation. To show people any religion is wrong or right would completely throw the world into a pit of fire (Hell, if you will) The box should never even be discovered or touched by man because once it is, then humanity would simply destroy the world and all the innocence that exists with it.
 
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#59
Heh, yeah. Can you say, 'Dark Ages'?

Society as we know it would be crippled. It's kind of nice to have a little gray area, as long as everyone is satisfied with what they believe in and all that.
 
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