A reason for tiredness?

[Richard B Riddick]

For awhile now, I've noticed a lot of people say they're too tired to do things. They don't have energy. They can't sleep at night & feel depressed for no reason.

Earlier today, I was looking for causes of fatigue & lethargy and found a source citing high blood sugar levels being associated with those conditions.

High blood sugar may be associated with insomnia, anxiety & depression.

It may also be linked to liver disease, high blood pressure & other health maladies.

Upon further investigation, it seems high blood sugar levels are typically associated with a diet where large quantities of sugar are consumed on a regular basis.

I looked for methods to decrease blood sugar levels.

Two interesting things popped up.

A.) Taking insulin is one method of decreasing blood sugar.

B.) Exercise on a regular basis decreases blood sugar levels.

C.) Proper nutrition & avoiding an excessive intake of sugar can also contribute towards stabilizing blood sugar.

...

Hehe. I see Draklor changed his name to Sherlock...

Ok, Sherlock. Given these clues and circumstances what assessment might someone draw assuming the facts and figures I posted are true?



Anyone want to take a crack at it? Or, disprove my statements.

Good luck'!

I think there could be an interesting point here somewhere, but I've been wrong before. We'll see!!

 

[ribbit]

For awhile now, I've noticed a lot of people say they're too tired to do things. They don't have energy. They can't sleep at night & feel depressed for no reason.

Well based on this first sentence alone, it's easy to tell they're probably not eating right. Depression for no reason? Anyone seen Super Size Me? Give away right there I wouldn't go as far to say that it's something like liver disease, etc. Plus this is America you're talking about.

Upon further investigation, it seems high blood sugar levels are typically associated with a diet where large quantities of sugar are consumed on a regular basis.

So this pretty much explains it. Obviously this isn't the case for everyone, but in the US, I'd go as far to say that this would be the most common cause.

 

[C i d]

I assume you are not being sarcastic or kidding, because you posted this in the sleeping forest section. But high blood sugar levels or hyperglycemia is not closely related to fatigue.

Anyway, a normal healthy person should not have prolonged high blood sugar levels. Unless you are:
A.) consuming certain medicine/drugs
B.) suffering from diabetes mellitus
C.) suffering from infections or inflammation
D.) suffering from critical iillness

When we consume food, the sugars do increase the blood sugar levels. However, the natural insulin hormone in our body takes care of this, and return the level to normal in a matter of time. This 'normal level' is the same for most healthy people, and it's maintained that way by the body's hormones.

There may be very rare cases where non-diabetic people take insulin as medicine, but you really need to consult a doctor before even considering this.

So consuming a lot of sugar in the short run period will not lead to prolonged high blood sugar levels. However, as we all know, if we continue doing that and do not exercise, there will be higher risks of getting diabetes. Now THIS is when there will be prolonged high blood sugar levels. However, when you get diabetes, fatigue is also accompanied by other obvious symptoms such as thirst and frequent urination. Anyway those methods you look up sound like treatments for a diabetic patient, instead of for a healthy person.

So while high blood sugar levels MAY cause fatigue, it's not one the main causes. One of the more plausible reasons are thyroid hormone problems and lack of sleep.

In fact, if one finds that he/she keep having prolonged high blood sugar levels, one may want to consider visiting a doctor. It may not necessarily be diabetes, but other more, or less serious conditions.

 

[Will Graham]

Don't just say you found a source, it is difficult to discuss it when you do not link us to whatever source you are using

Saying high blood pressure is associated with those ailments is in no real way indicative of causation. It could be that what causes these medical issues also causes high blood pressure. Like I said though, post the source you use, it'll make things much simpler

 

[Squid]

I think the cause of most peoples 'tiredness' is lack of motivation and laziness. Most of them don't do anything then stay up all night and then complain they're tired. It's not often you hear someone around here whinging of being tired because they did a hard day's work

Also I think depression then stems from there, you're at home bored, you sit there all day doing nothing but playing video games and staring at a computer screen. I remember when I left school and hadn't found a job yet, I was home for 3 months doing nothing but sitting at the computer and it was the only time I've ever found myself depressed.

Then insomnia I think comes from the fact that it has become 'cool' to stay up all night and then whinge about it the next day. Seriously like 40% of the people here have 'insomnia' of some kind I'd also blame the 'insomnia' on too much technology, it's always being said that you sleep worse if you've been staring at a screen too long or just finished up playing games right before bed... it's true for me anyway.

Either way, I am no expert (obviously) and have no proof that's just how I see it and no doubt the people with 'depression' and 'insomnia' will disagree with me and also ofc there will be those who have genuine depression and insomnia but they're over shadowed by all the others.

 

[Richard B Riddick]

Follow up.

0. Doctors & experts claim excessive sugar consumption does not cause diabetes(google provides plenty of examples).

1. Diabetes is generally defined as an individual not producing enough insulin to stabilize high blood sugar levels.

2.

3.

4. The sugar beet farming industry is worth billions. In 2014, the global soft drinks market is forecast to have a value of $511.6 billion, an increase of 16.2% since 2009. Without going into other industries which heavily rely upon sugar as an ingredient, its safe to say there is a lot of cash in sugar.

5. If sugar were accepted as a major cause of diabetes it would threaten the $400-$500 billion soft drink industry as well as the other industries which rely upon sugar as a major ingredient. If sugar did cause diabetes it could make sense for the soft drink & sugar industries to pay doctors & experts to falsify research claiming the opposite.

6. It may be well established academics & scientists fabricate nonsense for cash on a regular basis. Example: an anthropologist tried to help a strip club avoid paying taxes by claiming lap dances were a form of artistic expression.

7. It may well be established doctors & dentists fabricate nonsense for cash on a regular basis. Example: dentists have been caught unnecessarily recommending wisdom tooth removal.

8. There are documented cases of people being diagnosed with diabetes and being able to eliminate the condition by having a proper diet and exercising regularly.

...

Maybe I'm going off the deep end but I think there could be something to this, high sugar consumption leads to high blood sugar... Hih blood sugar leads to suffering thing.

 

[C i d]

Yes, very true. Diabetes is caused by either
A.) Insulin secretion problem in the body
B.) Body cells do not respond to insulin properly

(FYI, what insulin exactly does is, it stimulates the cells in the body to absorb sugar from the blood, and convert it into other substances, so that the blood sugar level drops)

I have also heard about studies that high sugar intake is not closely related to diabetes. But this may not be completely true. Consuming a lot of sugar means consuming a lot of calories. Excess sugar is converted to fats. Fats lead to obesity. Obesity IS another risk factor for diabetes.

But I don't understand what are you trying to say by putting up a lot of facts and studies on sugar and diabetes, when your main point of argument is hyperglycemia and fatigue.

High blood sugar levels leads to fatigue in diabetic patients mainly because it's prolonged high levels for them.

So again, I will repeat what I said in the previous post. High blood sugar levels or excessive sugar consumption for healthy people is not likely to be a significant factor that leads to fatigue or other problems such as anxiety, depression, etc. It IS a factor for fatigue, but I doubt it's a factor for long term fatigue.

 

[SaShman]

0. Doctors & experts claim excessive sugar consumption does not cause diabetes(google provides plenty of examples).

I couldn't find any. Feel free to share some.

6. It may be well established academics & scientists fabricate nonsense for cash on a regular basis. Example: an anthropologist tried to help a strip club avoid paying taxes by claiming lap dances were a form of artistic expression.

That is a pretty big assumption. Academics and scientists devote their lives to study in a particular field. Making deliberately false claims on their chosen subject would put their reputation on the line. While I'm sure some people do this they would most likely be a minority. Long story short, the academic community is not as corrupt as you think it is.

Also I'd question the source you provided too, but that's a bit off topic.

8. There are documented cases of people being diagnosed with diabetes and being able to eliminate the condition by having a proper diet and exercising regularly.

The source you provided isn't really a 'documented' case of someone eliminating the condition is it? That article is providing details on a single case which has drawn interest from the medical community. i.e it hasn't been properly investigated yet. Type 2 diabetes can often be managed through exercise and proper diet at first anyway.

http://www.diabetesaustralia.com.au/en/Understanding-Diabetes/What-is-Diabetes/Type-2-Diabetes/


I'm a bit unsure about what this thread is actually about. Your first post went one way and your second post went the other. Are you arguing that high blood sugar is associated with fatigue? Or are you trying to expose a conspiracy between the sugar tycoons and the intelligentsia?

Edit: Ninja'd

 

[Richard B Riddick]

Last follow up. I think it'll answer some of the things both of you brought up. I'll answer your posts laterr.

A. Consider blood alcohol levels(aka - alcohol intoxication). It can measured via breathalyzer. We can probably agree excessively high blood alcohol levels are caused by consumption or alcohol. Is there a significant difference between high blood alcohol levels and high blood sugar levels? Should one be caused by consumption and the other not be?

B. Imagine if doctors and scientists classified alcohol intoxication as "a persons body failing to metabolize alcohol fast quick enough to produce sobriety". Should diabetes and high blood sugar levels be classified as a failure of the body to produce insulin as opposed to an excessively high consumption of sugar? Would ignoring consumption as a possible culprit be bad science? I would say: yes. It creates a double standard where we admit alcohol consumption produces excessively high blood alcohol levels but refuse to admit sugar consumption can produce excessively high blood sugar levels. Bad science, ftw.

C. Now imagine if alcohol were a common ingredient and the average person consumed enough to chronically have elevated blood alcohol levels. Experts call this condition: "diabetes" & say its a disease. Pharmaceutical corporations produce a drug called "insulin" to lower blood alcohol levels. It becomes a billion+ dollar market. Doctors say blood alcohol is excessively high due to "genetic" reasons and it has nothing to do with over consumption of alcohol. Would this scenario be massively different from diabetes constituting elevated blood sugar?

D. I would conclude: If a person has high blood sugar(diabetes) the most likely cause of it is excessive sugar consumption. Unless someones snorting sugar, cramming it up their rear ends / absorbing it via osmosis, consumption may be the only logical explanation short of sugar entering the body via unknown means.

Doctors, scientists and experts have created a broadscale misinformation campaign, deliberately lied for sake of money, and thrown the safety and welfare of the public under a bus on the blood sugar -> diabetes issue.

Blah, blah, blah. I'll come back later and reply to your posts...

 

[CassinoChips]

Last follow up. I think it'll answer some of the things both of you brought up. I'll answer your posts laterr.

You still haven't provided any of your sources. Google is not a source.

A. Consider blood alcohol levels(aka - alcohol intoxication). It can measured via breathalyzer. We can probably agree excessively high blood alcohol levels are caused by consumption or alcohol. Is there a significant difference between high blood alcohol levels and high blood sugar levels? Should one be caused by consumption and the other not be?

Considering that the liver naturally releases sugars when you haven't eaten in a while, no, high blood sugar is not solely caused by overconsumption of sugar.

B. Imagine if doctors and scientists classified alcohol intoxication as "a persons body failing to metabolize alcohol fast quick enough to produce sobriety". Should diabetes and high blood sugar levels be classified as a failure of the body to produce insulin as opposed to an excessively high consumption of sugar? Would ignoring consumption as a possible culprit be bad science? I would say: yes. It creates a double standard where we admit alcohol consumption produces excessively high blood alcohol levels but refuse to admit sugar consumption can produce excessively high blood sugar levels. Bad science, ftw.

Nobody's ignoring consumption as a cause. It's certainly a factor. But it's not the only factor, and it's not the only cause.

C. Now imagine if alcohol were a common ingredient and the average person consumed enough to chronically have elevated blood alcohol levels. Experts call this condition: "diabetes" & say its a disease. Pharmaceutical corporations produce a drug called "insulin" to lower blood alcohol levels. It becomes a billion+ dollar market. Doctors say blood alcohol is excessively high due to "genetic" reasons and it has nothing to do with over consumption of alcohol. Would this scenario be massively different from diabetes constituting elevated blood sugar?

Because if you drank that much alcohol, you'd die.

Also, do you see black helicopters following you often?

D. I would conclude: If a person has high blood sugar(diabetes) the most likely cause of it is excessive sugar consumption. Unless someones snorting sugar, cramming it up their rear ends / absorbing it via osmosis, consumption may be the only logical explanation short of sugar entering the body via unknown means.

Or the inability of the body to produce the correct enzymes or the correct amount of enzymes to break down sugars in the body, therefore making the amount of sugar one ingests irrelevant.

Doctors, scientists and experts have created a broadscale misinformation campaign, deliberately lied for sake of money, and thrown the safety and welfare of the public under a bus on the blood sugar -> diabetes issue.

No, I was at that meeting, and they decided they'd create the "life begins at conception" myth instead.

 

[C i d]

Well the thing is, alcohol and glucose have different properties. You can't use them for comparison just like that. Besides, alcohol levels is reduced via the liver, not via the action of hormones.

Anyway, it is indeed true that when you consume sugar, it will directly elevate the blood sugar level in a quite proportionate relationship. This is because, while the blood sugar level is always kept constant by the INTERNAL systems, it cannot IMMEDIATELY be kept constant when an EXTERNAL effect is applied, to put it simply. Same goes for alcohol levels.

Actually, there IS an explanation of why excessive sugar consumption is THOUGHT to increase the risks of getting diabetes. (it's just a hypothesis though)

Let me describe it in Layman's terms:
1.) Excessive sugar intake
2.) Very high blood sugar levels
3.) MORE insulin has to be released
4.) Too much insulin leads to lower blood sugar level than the acceptable level
5.) Brain instructs to consume more sugar
6.) the cycle repeats
7.) The organ that releases insulin gets 'tired'
8.) In the long term, it loses its ability to release insulin properly
9.) leading to diabetes

However, like you said, recent studies have shown that it's not necessarily the case.

Still, there's no way we should not limit sugar intake. As I said in my previous post, excess sugar is converted to fats. This means obesity. Obesity is another factor for the development of diabetes. Obesity is also linked to other chronic diseases. And surely most normal people don't want to look fat if they can.

Terrible Terry Tate
Yes, it's true that the liver releases sugars when you haven't eaten in a while. This is because, the pancreas detects that the blood sugar levels are low because you haven't eaten. Thus when the liver releases sugars, it will return the blood sugar level to normal, not to an excessive level, most of the case for healthy people.

 

[Richard B Riddick]

You still haven't provided any of your sources. Google is not a source.

Well, I'm not writing a scientific paper with footnotes and such hence the informalities. :T

If you tell me which part you disagree with or what you want a source for I'll be glad to give you one, I s'pose.

For clarities -- you're assuming the position diabetes is not caused by sugar consumption?

Considering that the liver naturally releases sugars when you haven't eaten in a while, no, high blood sugar is not solely caused by overconsumption of sugar.

Bolded - a quote out of context.

The assertion was never that sugar consumption is the sole nor exclusive cause of high blood sugar. But, I would be willing to claim that it is likely the main cause.

Nobody's ignoring consumption as a cause. It's certainly a factor. But it's not the only factor, and it's not the only cause.

Its the main cause. Everything you're mentioning are very minor ones.

Because if you drank that much alcohol, you'd die.

Sugar is the same.

Also, do you see black helicopters following you often?

I think everyone who has ever said that to me has been forced to eat their words, eventually.

Or the inability of the body to produce the correct enzymes or the correct amount of enzymes to break down sugars in the body, therefore making the amount of sugar one ingests irrelevant.

An inability to breakdown sugar would likely be linked to high consumption of sugar as well.

People in general aren't adapted to living in an environment where sugar is plentiful and always available from a historical nor evolutionary perspective. Our physiology isn't accustomed to ingesting large quantities of sugar.

It would make sense, that a high consumption of sugar might weaken or break down a person's ability to metabolize it in the way that alcohol abuse would eventually destroy a person's liver which in turn would reduce their ability to metabolize(produce enzymes) alcohol.

Also, one might say claiming the amount of sugar a person ingests is "irrelevent" to the question of blood sugar levels is... counter intuitive.

In terms of proper nutrition and poor health, food choices are one of the biggest factors. With health issues like sugar blood levels it would naturally follow that nutrition and dietary measures would have a significant bearing.

To say nutrition is "irrelevent"... well, that's not something I've heard before.

Well the thing is, alcohol and glucose have different properties.

Having different properties doesn't identical circumstances and precedents do not apply to both examples.

You can't use them for comparison just like that.

Why ever not?

Besides, alcohol levels is reduced via the liver, not via the action of hormones.

I would say: the human body isn't adapted to a diet of high alcohol or sugar.

It doesn't matter so much that the processes for metabolizing or breaking down sugar & alcohol differ so much as human physiology isn't evolved sufficiently to deal with it, which can result in health issues.

Anyway, it is indeed true that when you consume sugar, it will directly elevate the blood sugar level in a quite proportionate relationship. This is because, while the blood sugar level is always kept constant by the INTERNAL systems, it cannot IMMEDIATELY be kept constant when an EXTERNAL effect is applied, to put it simply. Same goes for alcohol levels.

High sugar diets are not a part of the typical human diet from an evolutionary perspective. As said, we're not adapted to it.

Any means our bodies might have of handling or adjusting for elevated blood sugar are likely to be insufficient. Also, I would guess sugar abuse over a period of years could damage or diminish a person's ability to compensate for elevated sugar levels.

Actually, there IS an explanation of why excessive sugar consumption is THOUGHT to increase the risks of getting diabetes. (it's just a hypothesis though)

Let me describe it in Layman's terms:
1.) Excessive sugar intake
2.) Very high blood sugar levels
3.) MORE insulin has to be released
4.) Too much insulin leads to lower blood sugar level than the acceptable level
5.) Brain instructs to consume more sugar
6.) the cycle repeats
7.) The organ that releases insulin gets 'tired'
8.) In the long term, it loses its ability to release insulin properly
9.) leading to diabetes

However, like you said, recent studies have shown that it's not necessarily the case.

Still, there's no way we should not limit sugar intake. As I said in my previous post, excess sugar is converted to fats. This means obesity. Obesity is another factor for the development of diabetes. Obesity is also linked to other chronic diseases. And surely most normal people don't want to look fat if they can.

Yep, yep.

In another article I read, sugar consumption supposedly affects the brain in ways similar to herion, which could imply its addictive if to a lesser degree..

And, yeah....

 

[Shu]

I assume you fellas are referring to the medical terms and such. The only reason period I ever get tired is from fatigue. I literally have noticed that even working out and and such and keeping a good base diet, I can't stay up past 11:00 without an energy drink in my system. The amount of mental breakdown I do at my job on a daily basis is ridiculous and all I want to do sometimes when I get home is either numb my brain with video games, or sit back and watch a soccer/football game or a television show.

That's why usually I don't get on here, due what I might come across . No but seriously.. Fatigue is my major fall.

It doesn't matter what I take, unless I do an energy drink I'm out..

 

[Davey Gaga]

Upon further investigation, it seems high blood sugar levels are typically associated with a diet where large quantities of sugar are consumed on a regular basis.

No shit, Sherlock.

A.) Taking insulin is one method of decreasing blood sugar.

I wouldn't take a crack at that unless you wanted to screw up your metabolism and probably induce diabetes.

B.) Exercise on a regular basis decreases blood sugar levels.

Because sugar is broken down in an exothermic process to release energy; you need energy to exercise, so your body breaks down sugar and fat.

C.) Proper nutrition & avoiding an excessive intake of sugar can also contribute towards stabilizing blood sugar.

Again, no shit.

Not sure what the point is of this thread. Are you trying to debate what causes lethargy? Obesity? Depression? Or just discuss knowledge of nutrition?

I don't know where you want to go.

P.S. Quick technical point. Alcohol "isn't broken down by hormones, it's broken down in the liver" or something. Yes, it's broken down in the liver, but what do you think does that? Alcohol dehydrogenase, for a start.