Lack of Closeness

Do you find the chemistry in this game realistic?

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An effect of the internet, we don't see the other person so we don't get the visual cues from voice tone/body language that we would IRL and it's all down-hill from there :pacman: plus the anon effect...would be nice if everyone didn't have their shields up all the time, the 'net might be a friendlier place. Right, I'll get off my soapbox now :P

For the first half of XII the party definitely seems like they were randomly thrown together, for me it was on the Leviathan where I started to see the ties forming.
 
Sadly, the effect is contagious. It seems the internet style is the preferred method for any debate.

Plug your ears, shut your eyes, and scream as loud as you can. I just... I mean... why, why, WHY!

:eek:uttahere:
 
.:fairydust:. said:
Well, they were sort of lumped together, unlike X, where they all had some sort of link with each other, and VIII where they were all SeeDs apart from Rinoa- I think that the lack of closeness comes more from the fact that they were put together by coincidence more than anything else
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I disagree. I don't think it takes some immediate connection or "unified cause" to make the characters feel close at all.

Take IX for example... Their reasons for traveling together, initially, are all particularly independent. Eventually, they find common reasons to fight together, but for a good while, everyone had a somewhat selfish agenda or reason to "stay". So how did they manage to feel so close before they stood under a unified reason? By way of the great character interactions between them all.

The Zidane-Steiner squable, and their common interest to protect Garnet. Steiner's praise of Vivi. Vivi's friendship with Zidane and the group as a whole. Garnet's growing relationship with Zidane and "ties" to Steiner. Amarant's interest in Zidane and mutual respect with Freya, etc... The interactions between them (aided by things like "ATE"s) really let you feel underlying bonds between them or simply portrayed great chemistry amongst them. They turned the "coincidental" factor into a positive through great character interactions.

Arguably, it's this kind of thing that XII lacks. It doesn't matter how they got together. What matters is what happens while they are together. XII just didn't seem to come through with the kind of interactions to show us any chemistry or make us see them as that kind of group.
 
Sorry to revive this thread a week later, but I disagree. Sure there were some examples of closeness in the game but they seemed rather cold and hackneyed, with Balthier in his posh, devil-may-care attitude, and the lack of characterisation for the two teenage characters.

Take, for example, before the first battle with Judge Gabranth. Vaan goes off into a huge monologue about how Reks is dead, while Ashe has a monologue about her father's death. They talk over each other, none of the group showing sympathy or support for either, even at this late stage of the game.
 
may i ask who you disagree with? :>

i can see where you're coming from, but i will agree to disagree and leave it at that.
 
With those who think the characters are close. Sorry. I just never sensed a whole lot of chemistry and sense of friendship.

Fair enough. You have your points, and they're valid. I can agree to disagree.
 
I think that the characters chemistry is terribly realistic. They didn't interact too much during the game, so why would they begin to connect?

I don't get it. It kind of like The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess, Zelda and Link are never really close, but they know they have to work together to save Hyrule. Link and Midna, who HAVE been interacting, have more chemistry.
 
Wow, I'm way too late to responding to this thread. But I've been just so busy with other things.

But I'll respond to all the points made, since the discussion going on is absolutely delicious.

I'm gonna go point by point:

1) Zidane and Cloud comparison: It's not like I don't like these characters. I really do. I'm not a fangirl of either but I do like them a lot. I think that the only thing dragging them down is the dialogue. I don't mind that characters have complexes or anything. I love character develoment and these two had it. I just think that it wasn't as well presented. I think Cloud has the advantage because his story feels a lot more meaningful (to a certain degree). I still feel that the motivation they gave him to leave his hometown and enlist in SOLDIER was presented in such an awful way (I'm gonna impress the girl that doesn't give me the light of day because I know that I'm better than all of those stupid boys she hangs around with, about sums it up). It's just presented in such a sloppy way. His character development later in the game and the whole thing regarding the Shinra experiments was really good though and when he learns not to be selfish stands as a series highlight for me.

In the case of Zidane. I get the point of the scene which I mentioned. But again sloppy and poor dialogue. Zidane has a neat mantra though that makes his personality stand out in quite a good way: "You don't need a reason to help people."

2) All of this to say that the Final Fantasy XII characters had also a lot of redeeming qualities.

They do have defined personalities. Basch is like the voice of reason for the party and I really wish he had been given more focus as originally intended to per Matsuno's original scenario.

Vaan and Penelo are the two teenagers who live in poverty and lost not only their parents but also their country and they look up to these older people (Basch, Balthier, Fran, Ashe) who are also in search for something they lost. In the case of Basch his honor and to prove his innocence, in the case of Ashe the freedom of her whole country, in the case of Balthier to find out why his father has gone mad. The fact that he quit as a judge of Archadia shows that he's discontent with how things are handled there. I would have love more insight into this with a cutscene or something. These are characters with clear motivations and objectives, as any character in a work of fiction should have. The only one lacking is Fran, because they should have really have given her more backstory.

I'll agree that the Occuria should have been treated with a little more importance, but they still managed to feel like an ominous presence.

Vayne is an awesome villain because he's so atypical.

But overall the dialogue, which is the backbone of any work of fiction, flows more naturally and feels less contrived than say FFVIII's for example.
 
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i think that the chemistry between Vaan and Penelo was poorly portrayed, and also Ashes' relationship with Vaan seemed terribly fake however the relationship between Fran and Balthier was clear and you can see that they really care for each other. i also thought that the hatred between noah and basch was well portrayed, you could really feel the tension between them
 
Summoner Yuna points out that they all have very good individual strong points, yes.

Not together. Nothing seemed to bring them close at all. Just the fact that they all met and going on the same journey together. =/. Thier missions were so solo that it felt like individual stories trying to be lumped into one big one with a common enemy at the end and that's it. =/.
 
Am I crazy for thinking that the entire party tends to be more unified when Larsa is around? I mean, that little playful scene at Eruyt after you meet Fran's sisters sort of proved that along with the Mt. Bur-Omisace act of the game.

The Little Emperor gets the aloof main characters to finally act like FRIENDS in some scenes.
 
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