Cloud's Love Triangle - The LTD of FFVII

[The Witch]

It's always the past thing for why people don't like CloudxAerith. Those are all valid reasons and all, but--I just don't think it's how it is. Cloud and Aerith had their wedding predicted... they're stars are perfect for each other, that stuff means something.

I just don't think they'd have that stuff said if it wasn't to portray Cloud and Aerith as in love. And just because Aerith is dead, doesn't mean he has to move on with Tifa. That'd almost make her second best to Aerith.

 

[Six]

I think like this.

It doesn't matter how perfect any couple is portrayed, how perfect of a match they are, if you don't click, you don't click.

The way I see it, Cloud and Tifa feel and seem right. They're not forced in to perfection. There's no such thing as a perfect relationship.

<3

 

[Harlequin]

Does anyone else feel they all just friend zoned eachother? I mean come on no one goes as long and with so many opportunities as those three had without actually getting together somehow. Let's face the facts here, as much as you can argue who's the most compatible, you can't actually argue as to which one he prefers because he couldn't even man up and get with one of them. It was puppy love as best from start to finish.

 

[The Witch]

^Puppy love with both women?

I think like this.

It doesn't matter how perfect any couple is portrayed, how perfect of a match they are, if you don't click, you don't click.

The way I see it, Cloud and Tifa feel and seem right. They're not forced in to perfection. There's no such thing as a perfect relationship.

<3

That's not the point, Cloud and Aerith's stars are said to be perfect. Their marriage is predicted. If Cloud didn't love Aerith, why point out these two romantic details. Obviously, SE does think Cloud and Aerith are perfect for each other, otherwise they wouldn't have said this about their relationship.

And I didn't want to say this, but, I just don't think Cloud and Tifa are right. I'd go into detail, but it'd only seem like bashing. So I'll just say this, Cloud hides things from Tifa, he never calls, he lies, and he leaves. Nojima said that Cloud and Tifa have problems other than Geostigma and Sephiroth, and that those problems might still exist. That's not a good foundation for any relationship.

And, I just don't think Tifa can communicate with Cloud.

 

[Harlequin]

^Puppy love with both women?

Well yeah I mean I didn't even see Cloud and Aeris even hug let alone do any romantic touching (besides the optional date scene with her). It was like watching pre-adolescents on an awkward first date. There's far more physical intimacy between Tifa and Cloud in that respect, as well as emotional intimacy.

And, I just don't think Tifa can communicate with Cloud.

Well she had lengthy emotional conversations with Cloud throughout VII and they were as emotionally weighted as any dialogue involving Cloud got in the game. There's an obvious bond between Aeris and Cloud, but you can't just disregard the connection between Tifa and Cloud because of it.

 

[The Witch]

Well yeah I mean I didn't even see Cloud and Aeris even hug let alone do any romantic touching (besides the optional date scene with her). It was like watching pre-adolescents on an awkward first date. There's far more physical intimacy between Tifa and Cloud in that respect, as well as emotional intimacy.

I'd have to disagree. That date is pretty romantic. The creators said that their date in the city of desire(Gold Saucer)ends magically. Now, how can a date end magically? Anyway, sure we never see them kiss, but we never see that with Tifa either. Even under the highwind the way Cloud's sitting is very to himself. His arms aren't around Tifa or anything.

Which makes me gotta ask you, Tom--what do you mean physical intimacy? They don't even share the same rooms, nor can they even openly speak to each other. Where is there ever emotional intimacy between them? All Cloud ever does is lie and hide things from Tifa. He doesn't tell Tifa that he visits Aerith's church, he doesn't tell Tifa that he has geostigma, he doesn't tell her that he moved into Aerith's church which he later claims to be "his place" and he never ever calls her--the way Tifa thinks she'll fix Cloud's problems is by shouting at him and telling him to get over it.

That's not emotional intimacy. That's the making of a very bad relationship.

Emotional intimacy is Nomura saying Aerith's consciousness lives inside of Cloud, emotional intimacy is when Cloud calmly and comfortably admits to Aerith that he's looking for her forgiveness more than anything else.

I just don't see any intimacy between Cloud and Tifa, and right now, I'm just wondering where it's at? :/

Well she had lengthy emotional conversations with Cloud throughout VII and they were as emotionally weighted as any dialogue involving Cloud got in the game. There's an obvious bond between Aeris and Cloud, but you can't just disregard the connection between Tifa and Cloud because of it.

I have a very foggy memory but, has it ever been stated Cloud and Tifa have a bond? Nomura has said Cloud and Aerith have a bond and two person world, in which Tifa is jealous of. And that Cloud(and Aerith)exclude Tifa... but I'm not sure if their "bond" is as important as people make it to be, if they have one that is.

Having a two person world and a bond is... crazy romantic. And, as far as I know, Tifa doesn't have either with Cloud.

Tifa has more time in the game, so of course it appears she has more conversations with him. But they're about how she was keeping the true past from him. How Cloud was as a child and that's about it.

 

[Six]

That's not the point, Cloud and Aerith's stars are said to be perfect. Their marriage is predicted. If Cloud didn't love Aerith, why point out these two romantic details. Obviously, SE does think Cloud and Aerith are perfect for each other, otherwise they wouldn't have said this about their relationship.

And I didn't want to say this, but, I just don't think Cloud and Tifa are right. I'd go into detail, but it'd only seem like bashing. So I'll just say this, Cloud hides things from Tifa, he never calls, he lies, and he leaves. Nojima said that Cloud and Tifa have problems other than Geostigma and Sephiroth, and that those problems might still exist. That's not a good foundation for any relationship.

And, I just don't think Tifa can communicate with Cloud.

That's not the point either. Saying they have perfect matching stars, and having things predicted doesn't mean he automatically loves her. Maybe SE wanted people to think that, but maybe they had other intentions? You just can't say that while being a 100% sure.

If you don't think Cloud and Tifa are right, that's fine. That's totally your opinion, and obviously you dislike them together because you like CloudxAerith. I don't think they're right.

In my opinion Cloud doesn't 'hide', he tries to solve it himself, let her see he's stronger. He never calls for obvious reasons in Advent Children, the same goes for him leaving. Who does he come back to though? All the time.

I think Tifa out of all people can communicate best with Cloud, despite her shy nature. She understands him, and sometimes, as cheesy as it may be, it's true, words aren't the only thing that tell people what you're thinking, or what your intention are. (That's not meant in any perverted way at all).

And all that aside, it's not like he can communicate with Aerith now either, amirite? Don't hit me.

-

I'd have to disagree. That date is pretty romantic. The creators said that their date in the city of desire(Gold Saucer)ends magically. Now, how can a date end magically? Anyway, sure we never see them kiss, but we never see that with Tifa either. Even under the highwind the way Cloud's sitting is very to himself. His arms aren't around Tifa or anything.

Every Clorith seems to say this about the Highwind scene, although... Tifa is actually leaning against him. As far as the date with anyone in the Gold Saucer goes... They sit opposite from each other.

So... I think the first one is a tad closer, in all realistic honesty. xD

 

[Harlequin]

The creators said

I'll be honest with you Cali, I don't really take the creator's input seriously. I mean we're talking about a company that has whored the VII universe out. I wouldn't put it past them to weigh heavily on the Aeris side, she's dead after all so it can't really happen between them anyway.

Which makes me gotta ask you, Tom--what do you mean physical intimacy?

Where is there ever emotional intimacy between them?

I mean a physical expression of attraction. If a man and a woman aren't making physical contact (and I don't mean in a perverse way) there's a psychological barrier that hasn't been overcome.

As for the emotional intimacy between CloudxTifa they spoke painstakingly of the Nibelheim incident / Cloud's past / etc. I still remember mashing X for ages to skip the monotony of the dialogue.

Emotional intimacy is Nomura saying Aerith's consciousness lives inside of Cloud, emotional intimacy is when Cloud calmly and comfortably admits to Aerith that he's looking for her forgiveness more than anything else.

You don't feel as if that's clutching at straws? I'm not pro-Tifa or nothing, but it sounds like the creators are merely trying to keep the debate going for the sake of interest in the franchise.

Every Clorith seems to say this about the Highwind scene, although... Tifa is actually leaning against him.

There you have it

 

[The Witch]

That's not the point either. Saying they have perfect matching stars, and having things predicted doesn't mean he automatically loves her. Maybe SE wanted people to think that, but maybe they had other intentions? You just can't say that while being a 100% sure.

But, you're missing the point. Square Enix purposely told the viewers that Cloud and Aerith are perfect for each other and that a wedding would have happened, and not only that, but Nomura said when we learn of Aerith's death, it makes their marriage prediction very sad--why would it be sad? Because their relationship was torn apart.

In my opinion Cloud doesn't 'hide', he tries to solve it himself, let her see he's stronger. He never calls for obvious reasons in Advent Children, the same goes for him leaving. Who does he come back to though? All the time.

He does hide it, though. And he doesn't try and solve anything himself. Remember, Cloud's just going to give up and die. The only thing Cloud does is leave his friends and become an enigma. I think it needs to be addressed why Cloud never calls her? They supposedly have great communication and emotional intimacy, so why don't these lovebirds call each other?

All the time? He left seventh heaven, without telling Tifa anything, he went to his place, Aerith's church, and kept to himself.

Cloud goes back to his family of friends because it's just that... his friends. And he was only able to go back with his friends when he learned that Aerith was with him always, ending him suffering in loneliness.

If Cloud and Tifa were so perfect for each other or was so right, why would he suffer in loneliness until he figures out Aerith doesn't blame him and is with him always?

Cloud and Tifa are friends, that's why they don't share rooms, that's why Tifa's afraid of asking Cloud if he loves her, that's why Nomura has said he has no idea if Cloud/Tifa are together. He's the director, he'd no if these two were an item, and in his mind, they're not together.

I think Tifa out of all people can communicate best with Cloud, despite her shy nature. She understands him, and sometimes, as cheesy as it may be, it's true, words aren't the only thing that tell people what you're thinking, or what your intention are. (That's not meant in any perverted way at all).

I just don't see how she communicates with him. Vincent guessed right off the bat what Cloud was really thinking. In other words, actions speak louder than words, right, Kira?

And all that aside, it's not like he can communicate with Aerith now either, amirite? Don't hit me.

I won't hit you. I'll bite you.

And yes, Cloud can communicate with Aerith, her conscious does live inside of him, after all. They do share a two person world, and they do have a bond Tifa's jealous of. We see Aerith communicate to Cloud lots of times in AC. She speaks gently and comfortingly to Cloud in the flower field scene--she never raises her voice, she doesn't cuss, she doesn't flail her arms/hands around or anything. When Tifa's lecturing Cloud, he has his back to her and he never looks her in the face. But with Aerith, Cloud even tries to look back at her. If anything, Aerith communicates to Cloud better than Tifa ever could.

Every Clorith seems to say this about the Highwind scene, although... Tifa is actually leaning against him. As far as the date with anyone in the Gold Saucer goes... They sit opposite from each other.

Yeah, she's leaning against him, I still don't see Cloud's arms lovingly around Tifa. However, the date in the Midgar park, Cloud's hand is placed behind Aerith's back, that's a lot more open and relaxed than he was with Tifa.

And you forgot, on the date, Cloud can kiss her hand, that's more than we've seen for Tifa

What about Aerith's death scene though? Cloud cradles her body close to his, he buries his face in her chest, and pulls her close. That's more contact than Cloud's ever given Tifa. Not to mention the focused-on hand scenes between Cloud and Aerith. Their hand scenes even have climaxing music--it's being focused on for a reason.

I'll be honest with you Cali, I don't really take the creator's input seriously. I mean we're talking about a company that has whored the VII universe out. I wouldn't put it past them to weigh heavily on the Aeris side, she's dead after all so it can't really happen between them anyway.

Fair enough. But, this is a debate. All we can do is use every source of information as possible. That's what I'm doing. I'm not going to assume Cloud and Tifa have a bond when we've never been told hat.

I mean a physical expression of attraction. If a man and a woman aren't making physical contact (and I don't mean in a perverse way) there's a psychological barrier that hasn't been overcome.

Well, it's kinda kewl you brought that up. It's been stated that Cloud thinks Aerith's eyes are "impressive" and he even states that Aerith's smile is like a flower, he describes her laugh as innocent and then later says how he'll "never hear her innocent laugh ever again" and when he meets her on the streets of midgar and buys a flower from her, he even says her smile was a great purchase--When a guy describes a woman's smile to a flower and says she has impressive eyes, and then says her smile was a good purchase, it can mean one thing--attraction.

And as AC showed us, Cloud and Aerith do physically interact. But their separation doesn't stop their love. I mean, look and Tidus and Yuna, for all Yuna knew Tidus was dead, but she continued to love him for two whole years. Obviously it didn't stop them so why should it stop Cloud and Aerith?

As for the emotional intimacy between CloudxTifa they spoke painstakingly of the Nibelheim incident / Cloud's past / etc. I still remember mashing X for ages to skip the monotony of the dialogue.

Well, what about Cloud's big ol' sappy speech for her during her death?

You don't feel as if that's clutching at straws? I'm not pro-Tifa or nothing, but it sounds like the creators are merely trying to keep the debate going for the sake of interest in the franchise.

Which part is grasping for straws? You do realize, I can say the same "the creators are just saying it to keep the LTD going" about every source of proof for Cloti right? All we can do is take the creators words at face value. I'm not going to dismiss something because it doesn't make sense in other people's opinions.

Heck, if we can do that, I'll just right off a lot of the C/T proof.

And thanks for the picture, but you just proved my point. Cloud doesn't look very "ohmigosh we just said I love yous"

 

[Harlequin]

Well, it's kinda kewl you brought that up. It's been stated that Cloud thinks Aerith's eyes are "impressive" and he even states that Aerith's smile is like a flower, he describes her laugh as innocent and then later says how he'll "never hear her innocent laugh ever again" and when he meets her on the streets of midgar and buys a flower from her, he even says her smile was a great purchase--When a guy describes a woman's smile to a flower and says she has impressive eyes, and then says her smile was a good purchase, it can mean one thing--attraction.

As much as the qualities you've described are physical, the gestures are merely verbal. There's a difference between describing a girl's physical features and actually getting physical with her.

And as AC showed us, Cloud and Aerith do physically interact. But their separation doesn't stop their love. I mean, look and Tidus and Yuna, for all Yuna knew Tidus was dead, but she continued to love him for two whole years. Obviously it didn't stop them so why should it stop Cloud and Aerith?

I'm not saying they don't love eachother, only that their love can barely culminate into anything.

Well, what about Cloud's big ol' sappy speech for her during her death?

Someone had to give the eulogy

Which part is grasping for straws? You do realize, I can say the same "the creators are just saying it to keep the LTD going" about every source of proof for Cloti right? All we can do is take the creators words at face value. I'm not going to dismiss something because it doesn't make sense in other people's opinions.

Heck, if we can do that, I'll just right off a lot of the C/T proof.

You're right which is why I don't see the point in the debate if the creator's constantly battle to keep ambiguity in the mix. As soon as it seems one pairing is more feasible the creator's swing the debate in the other direction. It's a matter of preference rather than fact.

 

[Starships]

Is it okay if I join in the debate as well ? :stressedpanda:

It's always the past thing for why people don't like CloudxAerith.

I don't dislike CloudxAerith. I see Cloud x Aerith as a different opinion or point of view. And people have many reasons why they support C/T. It's all personal opinions. Apart from the past reason, I see Tifa as the underdog because she's so shy and Aerith is so beautiful, not calling Tifa ugly, but Tifa is kind of like Quistits from FF8. They're both very shy girls, and Aerith has the power and personality to get any man she desires. look how quickly Tseng and Zack fall for her. But.... Tifa is like Canada and Aerith is like America.

Those are all valid reasons and all, but--I just don't think it's how it is.

That's okay.

Cloud and Aerith had their wedding predicted... they're stars are perfect for each other, that stuff means something. .

To be fair. We don't really know if that's a right prediction. If the prediction was correct, Aerith would of survived and Cloud and her would of got married like Cait said. But that didn't happen, and Aerith dies. So doesn't that make the prediction kind of false ? " The Stars have meaning " seems like a Zodiac statement, like Cait meant because Cloud is a Leo and Aerith is a Aquarius, and those zodiac personality's are polar opposites, to me it sounds like Cait is trying to say that Cloud and Aerith are connected by being polar opposites to each other.

I just don't think they'd have that stuff said if it wasn't to portray Cloud and Aerith as in love. And just because Aerith is dead, doesn't mean he has to move on with Tifa. That'd almost make her second best to Aerith.

But Cloud and Tifa also had their childhoods together, and the way Cloud speaks to Tifa before the North Crater incident. He seems really caring towards her, and their childhood memories together seem really important to him. So really, kind of see C/T before Aerith dies.

 

[HearTifa]

I totally agree with _Symphonia.

Personally I think the whole Love triangle thing is a matter of interpretation. I think it was meant to be the player who decided if the whole Aerith date thing was meant to be or if something really went on between Cloud and Tifa under the Highwind.

And if Aerith giving Cloud that smile at the end of Advent Children...it's really up to you if Cloud returned that smile with love love or just friendly affection. And the whole idea of Cloud and Tifa living together....you decide if they're just best friends under one roof or a couple under one roof.

Even though it has been confirmed that Cloti is the official canon couple of FF7 (read it somewhere, forgot where ), it's pretty much up to you on what is true love or just mere affection, what's canon and what's not. Personal Cloti and Zerith myself but I'm okay with anything else. =)

 

[Saints&Storms]

I totally agree with _Symphonia.

Personally I think the whole Love triangle thing is a matter of interpretation. I think it was meant to be the player who decided if the whole Aerith date thing was meant to be or if something really went on between Cloud and Tifa under the Highwind.

Some people do believe that, but I don't think Nomura has ever said he had no clue if Aerith and Cloud were in a relationship contrary to Tifa and Cloud.

And if Aerith giving Cloud that smile at the end of Advent Children...it's really up to you if Cloud returned that smile with love love or just friendly affection. And the whole idea of Cloud and Tifa living together....you decide if they're just best friends under one roof or a couple under one roof.

We see Cloud smile after he tunnel visions to Aerith, its safe to say it was to Aerith, they went on a date in FFVII there are feelings there enough so for the Original commercial to call them a "Love that could never be", I think its more than interpretation.

Even though it has been confirmed that Cloti is the official canon couple of FF7 (read it somewhere, forgot where ), it's pretty much up to you on what is true love or just mere affection, what's canon and what's not. Personal Cloti and Zerith myself but I'm okay with anything else. =)

It wasn't confirmed. And if so I'd like to see some proof

 

[tilinelson2]

IMO, Aerith´s affection for Cloud only existed to make a deeper impact on her death. It is so obvious how most of the references happen just before Aerith death. The Cait Sith´s foretelling is an obvious example of that: it happens just in time to make the player raise expectations of a love between them that will never be fulfilled, as she immediately dies after that.

 

[Saints&Storms]

IMO, Aerith´s affection for Cloud only existed to make a deeper impact on her death. It is so obvious how most of the references happen just before Aerith death. The Cait Sith´s foretelling is an obvious example of that: it happens just in time to make the player raise expectations of a love between them that will never be fulfilled, as she immediately dies after that.

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here.

Are you saying that Aeriths love wasn't real but rather simply there for tragedy? I mean, I think her love for Cloud existed for Cloud to get a stronger resolution to save the planet, to keep the audience balling and once again to give the story depth and meaning.

Also to reinforce the fact that FFVII is all about three people; Aerith, Cloud and Sephiroth.

And SE has hit that home more than enough times.

But I feel compelled to ask, what say you who post here about the international versions of the commercial speaking "love" between Cloud and Aerith?

Why is Aerith the force that drives Cloud in FFVII to act about the Planet? I mean his words were;
"The cycle of nature and your stupid plan don't mean a thing."
"Aerith is gone."
"Aerith will no longer talk, no longer laugh, cry...... or get
angry......"

I also find it funny that, because of this display Cloud put on in effect of Aeriths death, that Sephiroth was finally wondering if Cloud had feelings? Of all their interactions, this was what made Seohiroth notice Clouds difference to him?

Because what Cloud felt here, Sephiroth noticed that he had feelings?

And on another part, something Cloud said here always made me wonder, he asks the question "What are WE supposed to do?" the "WE" who is it exactly?
He and Aerith obviously, if it weren't why would he hold his friends back and seclude him and Aerith in privacy, were they also the "WE" that he mentioned? So then, Cloud saw him and Aerith as a "WE"?
Are those really the words and actions of someone who simply feels a friendly affection toward another?
I mean, I understand loving family but remembering descriptive detail like that and becoming sad that you'll never see it again is just...Romantic, is it not?

Isn't it stated that Clouds feelings are different to that of Aerith's comrades?
Wasn't it stated that he carries his own affection and love for her? And that her date was the normal date?
Doesn't that make a total of two dates on their parts then? The park in sector 6, and then Gold Saucer?

And didn't Nomura say he had no clue if Tifa and Cloud were in a relationship?

And also, what about the Case of Lifestream; White? Aerith was stated to be the lover of Cloud, no? So that makes a commutative of 2 dates, Feelings contrasting to that of comrades, cherishing little things about her, disregarding the planet and its fate, the international commercials, Aerith on numerous occasions saying she loves Cloud much more than Zack...and like Cali always says...how exactly can a date end magically in the city of desire...and not be romantic?


And about the marriage prediction, why would it be all the more sad because Aeriths death, if not because, in cause of her death she and Cloud were separated this prediction of love now held aback? I mean if it were not sad because of this, why then, is it sad at all?

Sorry for the pseudo ramble xD

 

[tilinelson2]

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here.

Are you saying that Aeriths love wasn't real but rather simply there for tragedy? I mean, I think her love for Cloud existed for Cloud to get a stronger resolution to save the planet, to keep the audience balling and once again to give the story depth and meaning.

Also to reinforce the fact that FFVII is all about three people; Aerith, Cloud and Sephiroth.

And SE has hit that home more than enough times.

But I feel compelled to ask, what say you who post here about the international versions of the commercial speaking "love" between Cloud and Aerith?

Why is Aerith the force that drives Cloud in FFVII to act about the Planet? I mean his words were;
"The cycle of nature and your stupid plan don't mean a thing."
"Aerith is gone."
"Aerith will no longer talk, no longer laugh, cry...... or get
angry......"

I also find it funny that, because of this display Cloud put on in effect of Aeriths death, that Sephiroth was finally wondering if Cloud had feelings? Of all their interactions, this was what made Seohiroth notice Clouds difference to him?

Because what Cloud felt here, Sephiroth noticed that he had feelings?

And on another part, something Cloud said here always made me wonder, he asks the question "What are WE supposed to do?" the "WE" who is it exactly?
He and Aerith obviously, if it weren't why would he hold his friends back and seclude him and Aerith in privacy, were they also the "WE" that he mentioned? So then, Cloud saw him and Aerith as a "WE"?
Are those really the words and actions of someone who simply feels a friendly affection toward another?
I mean, I understand loving family but remembering descriptive detail like that and becoming sad that you'll never see it again is just...Romantic, is it not?

Isn't it stated that Clouds feelings are different to that of Aerith's comrades?
Wasn't it stated that he carries his own affection and love for her? And that her date was the normal date?
Doesn't that make a total of two dates on their parts then? The park in sector 6, and then Gold Saucer?

And didn't Nomura say he had no clue if Tifa and Cloud were in a relationship?

And also, what about the Case of Lifestream; White? Aerith was stated to be the lover of Cloud, no? So that makes a commutative of 2 dates, Feelings contrasting to that of comrades, cherishing little things about her, disregarding the planet and its fate, the international commercials, Aerith on numerous occasions saying she loves Cloud much more than Zack...and like Cali always says...how exactly can a date end magically in the city of desire...and not be romantic?


And about the marriage prediction, why would it be all the more sad because Aeriths death, if not because, in cause of her death she and Cloud were separated this prediction of love now held aback? I mean if it were not sad because of this, why then, is it sad at all?

Sorry for the pseudo ramble xD

Your pseudo ramble just proves my point to me. The "dates" never explicit says that there is really something going on, it is just to make you feel more attached to Aerith and make her death have a deeper impact. SE is smarter than you think and the authors would say anything afterwards of twist the story with sequels, prequels, etc in a way they could profit from that.

I love the way Cloud "really loves Aerith" when he completely forgets about her after her death. Anyway, the closest Aerith gots to Cloud is that she wanted to know him better, as it is stated in the Gold Saucer date. If this is "pure love", i.e. a person can really love another who he/she doesn´t even know well, this is a shallow definition of love. May work as a cheap romantic device to cause an impact in fiction, but will not work with someone who thinks of stories the same why he/she thinks about real life.

Anyway, I don´t care about your own views of the game, I don´t want to change them and I´ll not keep challenging every sentence you write because you are entitled to your opinions and it is part of every fictional story to leave holes that every reader/watcher can fill the way they want. Just my opinion was that, the potential Aerith and Cloud pairing is too artificial and was implied just to make Aerith death more dramatic in the original game. The other things stated in sequels, prequels or interviews do nothing to change this impression on me.

 

[Baron Van Wolfen]

Your pseudo ramble just proves my point to me. The "dates" never explicit says that there is really something going on, it is just to make you feel more attached to Aerith and make her death have a deeper impact. SE is smarter than you think and the authors would say anything afterwards of twist the story with sequels, prequels, etc in a way they could profit from that.

I love the way Cloud "really loves Aerith" when he completely forgets about her after her death. Anyway, the closest Aerith gots to Cloud is that she wanted to know him better, as it is stated in the Gold Saucer date. If this is "pure love", i.e. a person can really love another who he/she doesn´t even know well, this is a shallow definition of love. May work as a cheap romantic device to cause an impact in fiction, but will not work with someone who thinks of stories the same why he/she thinks about real life.

Anyway, I don´t care about your own views of the game, I don´t want to change them and I´ll not keep challenging every sentence you write because you are entitled to your opinions and it is part of every fictional story to leave holes that every reader/watcher can fill the way they want. Just my opinion was that, the potential Aerith and Cloud pairing is too artificial and was implied just to make Aerith death more dramatic in the original game. The other things stated in sequels, prequels or interviews do nothing to change this impression on me.

Well he dos think somewhat of her after her death. But then he also thinks of Zack constantly. The thing is in AC all he needs from both of them, is forgiveness. He`s not lovesick because Zack(lulz) or Aerith died, he just want`s their forgiveness to move on with his familiy. Now I no longer doubt Aerith loves Cloud and whatever the frak, but after she died and Cloud broke free of the puppet persona there is not a single instance or quote in the reunion files where anything love related to aerith is specified, from Clouds side, at least. She even says it`s up to Tifa now in MWTP.

 

[Saints&Storms]

@tilinelson

Do you have a basis for that other than...your opinion? You can say that but nothing proves it, the date was indeed, because there is a love between them, hence the advertisements. They wanted our initial assumption to be that Cloud and Aerith loved each other.

You can say it had no meaning other than to make Aeriths death all the more sad; but that proves my point -- which is -- Cloud and Aerith had romance.

Since you say the date makes her death more tragic, why else would it add to the tragedy other than because of the lost romance?

Oh yeah, he completely forgot about her after her death, Damn!

「

"彼の心に生涯刻まれることとなる古代種の血を引く少女」

A girl with the blood of the Ancients flowing through her veins who is engraved in Cloud's heart for the rest of his life." ~ Dirge of Cerberus manual

Cloud: "Even so, I have to fight. So, I can leave my past behind me. So I can be myself. And above all--- to unfreeze her smile." ~ FFVII Dismantled

Damn you Cloud for forgetting about Aerith after her death, I mean its not like you said you wanted to unfreeze her smile, said you'd never forgive Sephiroth after he killed her, went on to become depressed in AC and live in her Church and carry an undying feeling for her...damn you!

And in Tifa's words, not only did you lose Aerith, Cloud, but you lost a part of yourself.

"he didn't seem to lose Aerith only, a piece of him also seemed lost." ~ Dismantled, pg 138 of Dismatled

I mean sure, Cloud "forgot" about Aerith after her death, the same way he forgot about Tifas promise.

That's your opinion that its a "cheap romantic device", also I don't give a crap about real life situations in a game entitled "FINAL FANTASY".

I mean to say Cloud forgot about her after her death, thats not only a cheap shot, but its also insulting to Clouds character and Aeriths, you must not have played the same game as me because I never once saw him "forget" about her, after all that's what AC is about, her forgiveness of him.

The sad thing is, nothing I just wrote was my opinion, not once, its all fact proven, interview based text, not a word of it was "my opinion".
Mean while you want stop spouting how Aeriths interactions were just service for her death -- all the while having absolutely no base.

So far I haven't seen you answer any of the questions in my previous post i.e. not challenging them.

The Cloud and Aerith pairing was to artificial for you, in a game called FANTASY?

You can have you impression of the game, but why are you here if you'll basically ignore my posts, since I'll just be posting facts/interviews and such?

@Baron Van Wolfen

"Somewhat"? Nah, that ain't it man. Mind citing where he thinks of Zack constantly? Because when Sephiroth says he wants to take what Cloud cherishes, Cloud sees Aerith 3 times

AC is about him getting forgiveness from Aerith, not Zack, I mean don't get me wrong Zacks there to, but Cloud isn't dragging around because he died, we never even hear of his guilt for Zack in FFVII not once, even after he learns about his true past.

The thing is, he only wants it and yearns for it...from Aerith.

Proof? Why would Cloud fixing his persona, affect his feelings for Aerith? I mean I could understand it affecting Aeriths feelings for him, but not the other way around, or affect how he remembered her and their relationship? That just makes no sense.

 

[tilinelson2]

@tilinelson

Do you have a basis for that other than...your opinion? You can say that but nothing proves it, the date was indeed, because there is a love between them, hence the advertisements. They wanted our initial assumption to be that Cloud and Aerith loved each other.

You can say it had no meaning other than to make Aeriths death all the more sad; but that proves my point -- which is -- Cloud and Aerith had romance.

Since you say the date makes her death more tragic, why else would it add to the tragedy other than because of the lost romance?

Oh yeah, he completely forgot about her after her death, Damn!

「Damn you Cloud for forgetting about Aerith after her death, I mean its not like you said you wanted to unfreeze her smile, said you'd never forgive Sephiroth after he killed her, went on to become depressed in AC and live in her Church and carry an undying feeling for her...damn you!

And in Tifa's words, not only did you lose Aerith, Cloud, but you lost a part of yourself.

"he didn't seem to lose Aerith only, a piece of him also seemed lost." ~ Dismantled, pg 138 of Dismatled

I mean sure, Cloud "forgot" about Aerith after her death, the same way he forgot about Tifas promise.

That's your opinion that its a "cheap romantic device", also I don't give a crap about real life situations in a game entitled "FINAL FANTASY".

I mean to say Cloud forgot about her after her death, thats not only a cheap shot, but its also insulting to Clouds character and Aeriths, you must not have played the same game as me because I never once saw him "forget" about her, after all that's what AC is about, her forgiveness of him.

The sad thing is, nothing I just wrote was my opinion, not once, its all fact proven, interview based text, not a word of it was "my opinion".
Mean while you want stop spouting how Aeriths interactions were just service for her death -- all the while having absolutely no base.

So far I haven't seen you answer any of the questions in my previous post i.e. not challenging them.

The Cloud and Aerith pairing was to artificial for you, in a game called FANTASY?

You can have you impression of the game, but why are you here if you'll basically ignore my posts, since I'll just be posting facts/interviews and such?

@Baron Van Wolfen

"Somewhat"? Nah, that ain't it man. Mind citing where he thinks of Zack constantly? Because when Sephiroth says he wants to take what Cloud cherishes, Cloud sees Aerith 3 times

AC is about him getting forgiveness from Aerith, not Zack, I mean don't get me wrong Zacks there to, but Cloud isn't dragging around because he died, we never even hear of his guilt for Zack in FFVII not once, even after he learns about his true past.

The thing is, he only wants it and yearns for it...from Aerith.

Proof? Why would Cloud fixing his persona, affect his feelings for Aerith? I mean I could understand it affecting Aeriths feelings for him, but not the other way around, or affect how he remembered her and their relationship? That just makes no sense.

Do you think a line written anywhere many years after the game was made is a proof? Do you think you have unconditional proofs of your own opinion just because they match your opinion? Oh, grow up.

 

[Saints&Storms]

Do you think a line written anywhere many years after the game was made is a proof? Do you think you have unconditional proofs of your own opinion just because they match your opinion? Oh, grow up.

So what, anything after Final Fantasy VII the original doesn't count? And once again where did I form an opinion anywhere?

I based my opinion off the facts, I listened to the whole story and then formed a conclusion.