Why there is evil in the world?

QuickSilverD

QuickSilverD

I Think... Therefore You Are
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This came up in another thread here in the forums, the thing is if God is perfect and almighty and he created all that exist then why there are imperfections (Evil) in the world? People sin, but if the man was created by God, why did not he created a perfect man that would never sin? <o:p></o:p>
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I think there would only be 2 or 3 logical answer for this.

1. God is not really perfect, nor entirely good, thus his creations reflect the same imperfection

2. God is perfect but he wanted to create an imperfect world for reasons beyond our understanding (maybe a perfect world would be too boring), he also gave us us free will so we could decide by ourselves regardless of what he wanted us to do, this way he would be sure to have created actually worthy beings

3. The world is actually perfect, what we percive as imperfection and evil is actually part of God's plan, humans need the influence of evil in order to grow and choose the right path, there is evil so people can know it and decide to avoid it, by themselves, and with this experience becoming what God really wants them to be.<o:p></o:p>
 
There is a theory which consists of describing two main types of "Evil's" - Natural Evil and Human Evil. The titles given to these types of evil are relatively self-explanitory, but I'll explain anyway:

Natural evil includes such things as volcanic eruptions, tidal waves, earthquakes and hurricanes - that is to say, that these events occur naturally and are not influenced by human activity.

Human evil is created by humans - the obvious example being murder.

I still stick with the contradiction theory that God created everything and, therefore, must have also created evil. It's logical to conclude this for argument's sake. I remember learning something about Christians saying that God created evil to test us, or something to that effect ... but I'm afraid my knowledge on any religion, really, is vague at most. At least this gets us started.
 
How do we know what we percieve as evil to be evil?

Maybe what we percieve as evil is actually good, we don't really know do we?
 
The question of whether we know 2 is 2 is a different philosophical debate (study philosophy, its bloody brilliant!)

As to the question of why is there evil in the world, well that involves seeing onesself as a god (It's easy, just imagine you could go anything)

Now, I would say that the reason a god would put evil into the world is to understand itself. Where did I, omnipotent being that I am, come from. So you create a world and watch it, never interfereing, just watching in the faint hope that you might learn something about yourself.

Thats just my theory, if I believed there was a god then it gets more confusing in that it means that divinity requires endless insight.

A more humanistic approach works better for me. That is a belief like Kama. In other words , If im a nice guy then generally nice people will back me up and love me. If I'm horrible then nobody of any worth will. I may not get caught for murder or any other crime, but my life spent on Earth will be restricted and life will not be anywhere near as fulfiling as if I had been non agressive but helpfull and nice.

Note that I have not used the terms good or evil anywhere because that perception is based on society more than on the individual.
 
To me evil is a point of view. Yes, murder is a bad thing, but it is a point of view. To me some murders are justified. Ex. Saddam Hussein killed thousands of people, I believe he deserved what he got. An eye for an eye as the saying goes.
 
Evil is poorly defined because it's largely subjective. What is described as being evil in the bible may not actually be evil at all. There are many reasons why "evil" things happen in the world, be it a misunderstanding, an uncontrollable natural disaster (by the way, I don't believe God did those on purpose, he didn't do them), a psychological condition, a consequence or a coincidence. I don't believe there must be a moral reason for why evil things happen. They happen because it's a part of nature or probability, and it's only evil because thinking makes it so.
 
My Naval Instructor once said to the whole class that good intentions, no matter how good they were, are bad if it has a bad end. Bad intentions, no matter how bad they are, are good if there is a good end. Something along the lines of "the ends justifies the means" rather than "the means justifies the end." A great example of that is the proverb that goes "give a man a fish and he will live for a day; teach him how to fish and you will feed him for a lifetime." It's good to be able to feed someone but how does that benefit that person being feed? What if you die and that person depended on you for his/her daily fish? What then?

If you read Genesis, it says that man fell after eating a fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and bad. A lot of people tend to miss the last part. It was a fruit from a tree of "knowledge of good and bad." Recall what the serpent said? If you eat of the fruit of this tree, your eyes would be open and you will be like the Most High, knowing good and evil? But God warned Adam and Eva beforehand that the day they eat or touch the tree that is in the middle of the garden, they would surely die.

Therefore after eating the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, Adam and Eva should have knowledge of good and evil. Hence, they knew how to either be good or evil or do good or evil. God even said, "the man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil." Interesting. But if God knows good and evil, how come He is only one that is said to be good? (In the New Testament, a man called Jesus Christ a good teacher in which Christ's response was no one is good except the Father.)

The real question would be how does God differs from Adam and Eva even though all three of them has knowledge of good and evil? How is it that it is impossible for God to sin yet mankind is able to sin? So first is that we have to distinguish a dividing line between good and evil versus sin. Basically a differentiation between good/evil and sin.
 
The problem is that there isn't. At least not in a less religious context. The problem with knowing good and evil as that what we know as "good" and what we know as "evil" differs from person to person. There is no intrinsically absolute definition of "evil" and "good" that are the same within everyone, and that is the problem with eating from the tree of knowledge and knowing "good" from "evil"--the fact is, none of us really know what it is; we only have opinions of what they really are.
 
I disagree. There are reasons why there are laws out there prohibiting certain acts from being committed plus a hefty fine if those laws are broken. Laws are to protect us from each other but most of all from hurting ourselves.

Explain then why has committing murder, theft, adultery, bearing false witness and coveting been prohibited throughout the generations of humanity? There seems to be a general consensus through the generations about these five things isn't there? Or do you think these are merely the opinions of the majorities?
 
Juke said:
I disagree. There are reasons why there are laws out there prohibiting certain acts from being committed plus a hefty fine if those laws are broken. Laws are to protect us from each other but most of all from hurting ourselves.
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And these are man-made laws to prevent society from crumbling. But if we were to look at something like polygamy, you'll find that some cultures consider it good and fine, while others think it's wrong. In certain societies, it is accepted, and in others, it isn't.

Explain then why has committing murder, theft, adultery, bearing false witness and coveting been prohibited throughout the generations of humanity? There seems to be a general consensus through the generations about these five things isn't there? Or do you think these are merely the opinions of the majorities?
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They could just as well be opinions of majorities. But in history, there have been cases where murder is somehow allowable. Slaves, for example, don't get the same rights that most people do, and they could be killed, either from work or from gladiator fights. In Rome and Greece, they used to allow husbands to kill their wives if they weren't obeying, or their babies if they didn't want them.
 
Defining Evil

We generally define “Evil” as something that someone does intentionally and in full awareness to hurts or prejudices someone else or even him/herself.<o:p></o:p>
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Why people do something to hurt someone else? Well for the human being as any other animal the most important thing is “itself”, you would do anything in other to protect your own existence even at the cost of someone else existence. And this is a problem, because if there are two that are willing to kill the other to survive them, you see a fight coming.<o:p></o:p>
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We could add this very argument to war, why there are wars? Because people want to protect their own interest in other to satisfies themselves, you want other to follow your religion, you want other people’s land to help expand your kingdom thus protecting “your race”, or simply you know “or think” that the other is a potential danger that could at anytime destroy you or invade you, so you do it first. And that is the why of war.<o:p></o:p>
 
God created one thing: existence in its entirety.

As for good and evil, as Nietzche once stated, he is "beyond good and evil."

Good and evil are purely human terms to describe something they cannot fully understand.

Was Cain evil? If so, then why did Jehovah mark him and protect him thereafter? Is murder evil? If so, then why did Yahweh mark him and protect him afterwards?

Have you ever heard of the Cainites? They were Gnostic sect, second century. They rejected the books of the New Testament in favour of the Gospel Of Judas.

They believed that I created heaven and the earth, and that Cain was the persecuted party in that unfortunate affair with his brother.

They also held that the way to salvation was to give way to lust and temptation in all things.

And no greater percentage of them turned up in my domain than of any other religion. Amusing, isn't it?


And what of Lot? What virtuous acts had he aspired to that he should be spared the fate of Sodom and Gomorrah? Why, he offered up his virgin daughters to be raped instead of the two angels who came to visit him when the masses knocked on his door demanding to rape the angels. Such a pious, good and decent man, beloved by God.
 
Well i think of that just like my Mum told my if there wouldent be any evil there wouldent be any good,and the same if there wouldent be any good there wouldent be any evil.
If you need to use a Magnet you need a plus Point and a minus Point.
In every good thing you'll find something bad,and in every bad thing is hidden somewere something good.

I just hope you understand what i whant to say.Uff
 
I maintain nonetheless that yin-yang dualism can be overcome. With sufficient enlightenment we can give substance to any distinction: mind without body, north without south, pleasure without pain. Remember, enlightenment is a function of willpower, not of physical strength.
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Good and evil exist. Said the atheist. I don't need god to define it. And I don't need useless children telling me "other people have different opinions" as if that somehow proves good and evil aren't real. I wonder if that type of person has ever been in a school, ever been in a classroom full of students who all have their own opinions, most or all of which are completely and utterly wrong. Because there is no reason, absolutely no reason on earth, why you should believe "other opinions" are somehow inherently legitimate if you have had the experience of one day, just one single day of education.

Human life is of axiomatic value. You can't question that human life is of value without assuming it is of value - ie, anyone who thinks human life is not of value should kill themselves. They will then be unable to complete their argument, which is logically the situation they find themselves in anyway.

Similarly, those who think that human life is not an absolute value from which to derive good and evil should be rounded up in a great stadium and subject to all the variety of evils human sadism can and has imagined. At any point in time they can escape, so long as they accept that good and evil are real. If they refuse to admit this, they will of course die.

This is exactly the position the entire human race finds itself in. Either there is good and evil, and hence a list of choices that we should make compared to choices we should not make, or the species will suicide, and aliens on some other planet somewhere will wonder if they are alone in the universe.
 
Crash said:
Human life is of axiomatic value. You can't question that human life is of value without assuming it is of value - ie, anyone who thinks human life is not of value should kill themselves. They will then be unable to complete their argument, which is logically the situation they find themselves in anyway.

Similarly, those who think that human life is not an absolute value from which to derive good and evil should be rounded up in a great stadium and subject to all the variety of evils human sadism can and has imagined. At any point in time they can escape, so long as they accept that good and evil are real. If they refuse to admit this, they will of course die.

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I like the way your mind works. I could have some jobs opening up, if you're at all interested.


Human life though, has no more value than that of any other animal.
 
I don't think there is evil in the world. "God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good." Genesis makes it very clear that God didn't screw up when he created the universe, so there is really no way that evil can get into the picture. Rather, the Biblical idea of "evil" seems to be people just thinking that they are more unfortunate than they really are. Jesus's healings are even more proof of this- he never claimed to have resurrected Lazarus, rather, he said that Lazarus was sleeping and told him to come out and walk. The people around him were fixed on the idea that Lazarus was dead, that evil had overtaken him, yet Jesus showed that this was never the case. From a purely Christian point of view, merely saying "evil exists" goes against those principles.
 
Evil exist as a counter balance to goodness. If there wasn't anything evil in this world we would never be fully able to appreciate what's good, or perhaps even know what good was.

Everything that exists has a counter balance, if it didn't nothing would exist to begin with.
 
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