A Couple of suggestions for the current RP rules system.

[The Illusive Man]

Just being thinking of a few ways the RP's could be improved, more importantly so, the RP battle system, when I decided to take a glance at the rules and thought of a few ways they could be improved....

As they currently stand, the rules can be, how do you say...a little restrictive on the imagination, taking away from the unpredicatably of some fights...

The rules are in place to protect against godmodding and powerplaying however, I feel the current state is far more restricting than it should be and brings in a powerplay element of its own.....the possibility of blocking and dodging just about everything....

I know some of you out there will disagree but ill throw up a scenario for you, based on how the current rules go....

Cloud is fighting Sephiroth in a long battle, neither is gaining any quarter as they block and dodge each others attacks, Cloud makes a last ditch assault on Sephiroth, who is by this point totally exhausted and goes to omnislash a fatigued Sephiroth.....who blocks it!

Now I know what your going to say, but the people rp battling in that scenario could easily let the person hit them.....and what if they dont feel like being hit? or there in a bad mood?

Under the current rules system omnislash would be something like this:

Omnislash: Cloud unleashes a devestating assault of blindingly fast sword strikes, finishing off with a hugely powerful downward slash, this move costs Cloud a lot of energy, can be dodged or blocked however...

Now my proposal is to make a slight alteration of this, not to encourage powerplaying, far from it, im also very much against powerplaying and godmodding as it ruins RP's and RP battles to no end...

I propose a system that allows people to have unblockable or un-dodgeable attacks, but they have to carry special stipulations so the person RPing that character cant constantly post..."I used omnislash you cant block it your dead dude", "but more of I used omnislash, I hope it does enough damage because my character is going to be worn out after its done".

If anything id probably have a system much like often seen in the likes of most RPG's, some attacks can be unblockable, some undodgeable or even uninteruptable....but the stipulation would be your character can only designate 2 skills as one of these special flags, from the following list:

Unblockable
Undodgeable
Uninteruptable
Quick Cast (can be instantly cast once a RP battle rather than channeling it up for a moment like most spellcasting is written in RP)
Escape Spell (moves them to a safer distance, basically teleport as it should be but only useable once an RP battle)

Instant Rez, Sucidial skills, or life leeches would be outright disallowed as these are by far the most godmodding or powerplaying abilties going, however a life leech could be acceptable, if it was to say, drain at there strength weakening there next attack attempt while blostering your own, but the effect would wear off as soon as that round of attack writing is over.

Ultimate Attacks/ Desperation moves: No RPG or Anime has ever gone without some kind of powerful last ditch or desperation attack, since the days of D&D pen and paper these have been around, from the humble meteor spell, to the awe inspiring limit breaks we see today, Ultimate attacks have always been a staple part of the diet...

However under the current ruling, ultimate attacks and desperation moves are pretty much outright forbidden due to them being under the "powerplay" classification. Again I propose a change to allow every bio to be allowed to include one awe inspiring last ditch ultimate attack that would be extremely hard for there opponent to avoid, there will be however special stipulations in place, as well as every single ultimate move MUST I REPEAT MUST have a weakness and a counter to, either it be a magically enchanted shield that nullifies it, or it outright failing against certain types of armor....The attack also must be EXTREMELY DRAINING, hard to pull off (cant just start a fight and go straight off into your desperation, as that would just ruin the whole thing) and only useable if the right circumstances are met (Rage, Arena type, Magical conditions, Weather conditions, anything that would be a required circumstance, but the Ultimate attack requires to meet at least 2 different flags to be considered useable) and above all, none spammable.

So under the proposed system Omnislash would look more like this:

Omnislash : Cloud unleashes a devestating assault of blindingly fast sword strikes, finishing off with a hugely powerful downward slash, this move costs Cloud a lot of energy and he will be weak and exposed for a few moments afterwards, Cloud needs to have been injured and extremely enraged at his opponent to unleash this attack, it can be countered by an offense of your own knocking Cloud off his concentration and only the fastest can avoid the inhuman speed of Clouds swings, blocking does little to stop his brutal assault.

As you can see above, special stipulations have been noted, his ultimate attack also carries 1 unblockable flag, meaning he has 1 special flag to spend on another attack, and a counter of attacking him back to knock him off his concentration and stride have been noted.

Now lets talk about Procs....

Procs: most commonly found on weapons, from way back when, even before dungeons and dragons, weapons in rpg boardgames and so forth have carried procs. Procs are Pro-Active abilties that trigger on special circumstance such as "on-hit" or "on-block" and trigger off a special effect of some kind when activated...

Under the current system, most procs are outlawed and only a "few" are allowed, I put " over the few because I've yet to read a bio with any kind of proccing weapon, shield that have ever been accepted...

Proc's are an interesting way to give your character a special "thing" that makes them a little more unique, although as im informed they fall into the realm of powerplaying, however I dont believe this to be true as long as you meet special stipulations and flags that mean it cant always hit and wont always work.

Heres a great instance, The Ragnarok from FF6, a sword that on-hit has the chance to proc flare, this sword would be outlawed under the current structure as its deemed too powerful, however heres a way to make it work, without it being a "powerplay mod".

Ragnarok: The firey sword of the heavens, sometimes when the sword touches flesh, it will attempt to burn its vicitim with a firey flare blast, this takes a short moment to leave the blade as it flashes with white-hot light and casts out the flare, giving the opponent opportunity to move out of the way or get a shield up to block, because of its magical nature, the flare does little to no damage to anything protected by magic forces or made of fire.

As you can see, the ragnarok would still carry its proc, but it wont always trigger when it strikes someone and there are special stipulations in place allowing for it to be defended against, or even outright resisted.

Poisons: As far as im informed, poisons in any way shape or form, are outlawed, again, I feel this takes away from the imagination and does damage to anyone wanting to RP as assassins, thieves, toxic mages or anything else that might make use of poisons.

Poison has always been a huge part of the toolset of the characters that travel "the darker path" and to completely dissallow all forms would not allow the character to live to its potential..

My proposal is to allow certain poisons, but again carrying special stipulations, such as ineffective against certain races, or even outright resistable.

Poisons would also follow a short duration system, they cannot be active for the entire battle if they take effect, and could possibly take a while to come into play as the poison works its way into the opponents body, so there is plenty of time for the victim to drink an antidote, cleanse themselves or do whatever they have to do to avoid the effects of the poison before it takes hold.

Poisons Id allow:

Numbing: Slows the character down when it takes effect, making it harder, but not impossible to dodge.

Vision Bluring: Impares the characters vision making it harder for them to strike there target (moves become more telegraphed), but still possible to strike as it only blurs there vision and not outright impares it.

Strength Weakening: Weakens the characters muscles, making there strikes weaker for a short duration making them much easier to block, they do less damage to there opponent but can still hit them regardless.

Poisons I wouldnt allow: Anything that holds a character in place, paralyses them or stops them from being to act of there own accord, the idea is to only make there job a little tougher, not outright dominate control.

More suggestions will follow, your welcome to discuss these ideas amongst yourselves or come up with your own!

Lets see if we can take the RP battle stories to the next level, and make them a little more accessable and fun for all, allowing for that little bit more imagination, and a little bit less red-tape

 

[AlchemistFox]

All the things mentioned in your post, is only towards the RPB part of the forums.
As I for one, don't have anything against anything you have mentioned, however it all comes down to balance.

Lets take it step by step here.

Overly powerful/desperation attacks.
These are not outlawed per se, but they have severely high balancing issues behind them.
Taking Omnislash, I would have no problems approving this, even in an RPB, if it is detailed enough. Containing a logical drain as well as "escapabillity"

Things like that aren't booted out the window due to their power, but they are booted out due to the fact that of they are often under detailed.
Here, an example.

My character, Alumar Loren, has a spell that when fully charged. It has the power to wipe out an area the size of France of the map. Even though this power is insanely high, he is still approvable, why?

After cast, he is unable to cast magic for a long time, and even a mortally ill 5 year old can stab him to death.
Teh casting time is a long chant, nad cna be interrupted as easily as shouting his name or throwing anything at him. In other words, direct eve nthe slightest part of his attention.

But, even if this spell is cast, and not interrupted off course, the enemy players will have ample time to get away, or take precatiouns before it acctually hits.
So, the balancing in this particualr spells is that though it is powerfull, it is very easy to interrupt, nad the opposing players will ahev time to escape.

While this is nto ecactly the same that you are using, Im taking it into the discussion as it shows that it is not hte power that we ban, it is the lack of detail, energy drain, and escapabillity that most players show.

In RPB's, the Battle master (RPB creator) have the option to set his own rules, so he can allow said things for his battle, or he can outlaw anything.
The rules here at FFF, is made so that making such spells in discuraged. This in turn makes the more experienced ones think about balancing, where as the ones that are not yet deep enough in balancing to simply avoid it untill said time arrives.

For poisons, this is due to the indirect G-modding that they have.
Lets say that we have a blade taht is poisoned, nothing big, yet effective. Lets go for a vision imparing one.

Your character attakcs mine with said blade, and I in good sport take a slight cut to my right forearm in a botched attempt to block your strike.
Is the wound infected, or not?
I as a good sport, try to take this in, and get affected. Then the thing comes, how bad will my character be affected?

Lets use your example:

Vision Bluring: Impares the characters vision making it harder for them to strike there target (moves become more telegraphed), but still possible to strike as it only blurs there vision and not outright impares it.

Ok, my charcter widenes his stance, as his vision becomes like waching underwater. Why? I misunderstood the description, or perhaps my char just reacts to it likethis. As every person is different.

Ok, you launch another attack, and I block this.
Then, the discussion MIGHT start, the attacker might start "but you can not see properly" where as this is true, the description is clear, so this is "allowed" per se.
"But the description states that I can still see, it is juse harder"
While this explains nothing beside waht is already said, it backs it up.

Where as Poisons are allowed in RP's, we have outlawed it in RPB's due to the effect of G'modding. As indirectly as it is it is still G'modding.
Yes, I could have chosen to dodge your blade, but I can not do that forever, as taht would be powergaming.
Even when struck, who desides if I got poisoned at all?
If you decide it, I might feel that it is G'modding that you do this.
If I decide, you might feel that it is powergaming that I do this.

So, things such as poisons and such, are outlawed in RPB's due to the apparent discussions, nad possible breaking of 'rules' like this.
Where as in a normal RP, these rules are not as strict as in RPB's. I for one have an assassin that specialises in poisons. But I never use them aginst other PC's due to this problems.

A life leetch attack, this is also fine but should be avoidable, or at such a low rate that it will not be too severe.

Example1: It can be an attack, that has to "hit" as cast, example is if it is cast as a fireball, just nto a fire elem,ented attack. if hit, it cna have na instananious drain, or over time.

Exampl2: it can be an AOE effect, say upon activations the user can slowly leech off energy from sorrounding characters. This is G'modding per se, but as it is so small, it will technically not affect the other players. So while they are in a way forced to notice it in a way. They dotn have to make anything happen due to it.

These are allowed, but they have to be amply discribed, and avoidable/escapable.

Im a pen & paper RP'er myself, so I know hte fustration of wanting more form text basd RP's. I too have worked my arse off to make things happen.
Where most things mentioned, are directly or indirectly outlawed, it is due to the single purpose of balancing.

ALLTHOUGH
I understand waht you mena, I agree on all points. But you have to take into consideration that you might be on a "higher level" then some new starters.
Consider this, you as a "high level" player, have a character with a poison attack. In a battle you wound, and affect, a new player.
The player tries to note the poison, and be affected by it. Off couse we take it differently with new players, trying to explain and help instead of force and command. But what if you calmly and politely explain that he is wrong, and supply and example of how it should work.
The new player might atke heed of this, and attempt to make it happen. This is how I started out. A new player, did a HELL of alot wrong, but I was told and helped along the way.
Then we have the other side. he might get mad, he might attempt an report ot a mod. Where as the mod will back up you in this case as you did nothing wrong.
But this again can raise further questions.

Again, where I understand your ideas and wishes. The reason is still balancing.


HOWEVER (again)
I do have plans for a small tournament where all the mentioned effects are not only LEGAL, but encouraged.
So that everyone can get a taste of how it works. So in time it might change.

So, onto the proc thing.
Where as I like the idea, we are back to the "who decides if it happenes" part.
Poisons, procs, and whatever that requires chance. Work out best when you have another person to make it happen or not.
The so called Game master (GM). Off course we as staff could make this effect happen or not, using dice off course so that it becoems random instead of "I feel like it" effect.
Which I intent for the torunemant thing I mentioned.


So, end line for now, the reason is due to balancing, and gray areas of G'moddign and powergaming.
Were as they should be allowed, they are not for apparent reasons.
Off course there are differences to everything. The posisins will off cousrse never be fatal, only "draining" effects.
If they are to be during the whole fight, or not, can be discussed based upon several aspects.
Id gladly sit down and make up some test rules with you, over MSN or something. So that we can try them out in a RPB, or a normal RP for that sake. And see what happenes.

If I mixed up things, or said hte same thing 3 times, Im sorry bout that. ^^
If I missed a subject, feel free to remind me, as Id gladly take these ideas futher and instead of banning them, developing on them.
I became a mod not 3 days ago, so dotn expect everything to change right away. I have had plans for things along these ways for ages, I jsut never had a way to get them past planning stages.
So, I will embrace this post, and build on it insread of trying to deny it.

 

[The Illusive Man]

Hi there, just wanted to say thanks a bunch for replying and taking a few of the ideas into possible account.

I'd also like to say I would be all for the Dice idea, as I feel it would give GM/Judge a more active roll in the battle (no pun intended )

of course the idea list I posted was more to get the ball rolling than a definative list of things, Id really like to hear more people coming forward with there ideas, especially people new to RPing, this is your forums and RPB's were discussing after all.

And I really look forward to that tournament you can most definatley count me in for that one

 

[AlchemistFox]

Good that I did not mess things up too much ins my examples and explaining.
Im glad for several reason that you made this topic, and fear not the tournament i mentioned will be put in use, however it will not be until after the current one, so not to fuck up everyones mind.

As for the poison and desperation attacks (limit breaks), I will have to make rules and balancing effects for everything, as mentioned before Poisons are G'modding in itself. however if balanced and detailed properly it will not become G'moddign any more.
Same for the powergaming effect of avoiding the posion.
These things are some of the things i have tomake rules for, os taht I cna effectively eliminate the banned areas of said effects.
So dnt expect it up before the currect tournament is gone.

However Id be glad to GM a RPB between you and a fellow member if you'd like that. If so I cna bring out my selt of D20's and D10's and really go GM on your ass. That way you cna use poisonas as you wish. And I can set up a "rage meter" thing that will work as to fill your "limit gauge". As to make that a logical effect.

Oh, dont hesitate to come with more ideas, and please remind me about starting this as the current tournament is resolved, so I dont forget ^^
If there is anything more, feel free to update this thread, make a new one (if it is different), if not I have plenty of space in my PM box ^^

Also, for more active and "hands on" discussions, I added you to my MSN and feel free to add me to yours (its in my profile).

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EDIT:

An interesting effect you'd like ^^
This rule is taken from the Fighters Quarry, which is the RPB section

1.) Follow the Battle Master’s rules:
The Battle Master, or creator of the Battle, is to set up specifically restricting rules in their battles while in this section. These can range from no magic to sky battles, but you must follow them at all times.

So there is NOTHING in the way for you to make a small set of custom rules. This includes poisons and the like.
As said, if you'd like a GM in there to make the poisons afflict, the proc's to activate and other such things which are considered "random". Id be glade to be that person.
If you'd like a person to only go "*dolls dice* The poison worked" or a GM that takes control from there and even explains what is happening "the blade makes a light scratch on CHARACTER A's upper arm, giving the poison what it needs to enter the blood stream, CHARACTER A starts to feel woozy, and his vision blurs..." and so on.
Id gladly take on both aspects ^^