KH Kingdom Hearts Totally Butchered Final Fantasy...

[mrdaggoth]

I understand that combining a childlike Disney affair with RPG elements is a smart and effective way to integrate mathematic skills into children.
And I also understand that Kingdom Hearts is a product of Square Enix.

But in my opinion, they destroyed the characters from Final Fantasy. I remember seeing Auron and Cloud and just doing the biggest face palm. -_____-

Wouldn't it just be cool if Kingdom Hearts had nothing to do with Final Fantasy characters?
It would be soooo cool if it was based solely on Disney Characters (not the typical ff protagonist, Sora and his typical pink haired ff damsel, Lenna. Ooops! I meant Farris. Oerbis. SORRY, Kairi).

These are just my opinions though, feel free to bash me- I already know you will.

 

[L]

honestly, i don't pay that much attention to them since their involvement with the game is limited to Hollow Bastion.

I don't think I'd miss them if they were gone.

 

[KillingJoke]

Final Fantasy ruined Final Fantasy. When I wanna think about things that ruined Final Fantasy the first places I turn are usually spinoffs. Dirge of Cerberus, X-2, and FFXIII in general. If anything Kingdom Hearts gave Final Fantasy a fresh face and brought in a new audience.

 

[mrdaggoth]

If you want to blame spin offs, Kingdom Hearts is a target culprit. Before Kingdom Hearts, there was actually a die hard "hardcore" element that belonged to each of the main final fantasy games. Kingdom Hearts taught the audience that Sir Auron and Mako Warriors are equivelent to tinkerbell magic and donald duck's whiplash lisp.
Final Fantasy is not dirge of cerberus, X-2, XIII-2, Legends, Crystal Chronicals not Kingdom Farts. Final Fantasy is Final Fantasy.

 

[Davey Gaga]

Final Fantasy is the reason I picked up Kingdom Hearts and its ties to that Universe is the reason it's so sucessful today. How many of you would seriously have picked up a PS2 RPG game with Donald Duck and Goofy Goof on the front cover? You'd have assumed it was one of those terrible Mickey Mouse haunted house-type games.

The characters serve as cameos to tie both worlds together. If that didn't happen, it'd basically be Disney giving money to SE for script-writing. Yes, the characters weren't the same as what we came to love in the original games but, to be honest, neither were the Disney characters. For all intents and purposes, their "stories" stayed the same.

It's a different issue entirely if you want to bring terrible sequels in to the debate.

 

[Shaissa]

So how did Kingdom Hearts exactly ruin Final Fantasy to you? Do you mean the character design? Or that the characters have very minor roles?

As far as the characters go, when they were used I feel that they did a good job at showing how they would act in their own game, for an example Auron talking about it being "his story" and the way he acts (minus when controlled by Hades) is how I would see him acting in Final Fantasy X.

Same goes for all the other characters (minus maybe YRP, but I never liked X-2 that much, so I can't say how they would act since Rikku and Yuna do a 180 between the games as far as personality goes.) But Cloud, Squall, Aerith, all act like how I believe they would act in there own games at some point (Squall in KH acts more like how he would later in the game.)

In all honesty Kingdom Hearts is its own series, yes it had Final Fantasy Characters in it, but at this time, all they do is play a minor role, or as some goodie extra boss fight (SEPHIROTH!)

So no Kingdom Hearts didn't ruin Final Fantasy. Final Fantasy is Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts is Kingdom Hearts. That is that.

Also with what Kerrigan said, many people picked Kingdom Hearts up originally was because it had Final Fantasy ties to it, so that alone started the sales for Kingdom Hearts. Really how many people would of picked up a "Square/Disney" game without them trying to add the Final Fantasy element into it first?

 

[mrdaggoth]

I understand that Kingdom Hearts brought SE a lot of $$$ from marketing to young children instead of teens and adults. But I don't think that Kingdom Hearts supported Final Fantasy itself in any way at all. Kingdom Hearts came out right after X right? Isn't that when Final Fantasy started plundering? I see it that KH changed the market scheme of SE and tried aiming at a broader, more modern audience. With this attempt they tried dispatching online multiplayers and future esque themes with overly simple gameplay (ff13) I guess to dumb down the game for the lesser intelligent players? (players like that of kingdom hearts, ranging ages 8-14)

Kingdom Hearts IS creative! It really is a splendid idea to make a vigorous RPG out of beloved Disney characters. But leeching off Final Fantasy characters is distasteful, especially when they try to change things. Who the **** is Aerith?

 

[Shaissa]

I understand that Kingdom Hearts brought SE a lot of $$$ from marketing to young children instead of teens and adults. But I don't think that Kingdom Hearts supported Final Fantasy itself in any way at all. Kingdom Hearts came out right after X right? Isn't that when Final Fantasy started plundering? I see it that KH changed the market scheme of SE and tried aiming at a broader, more modern audience. With this attempt they tried dispatching online multiplayers and future esque themes with overly simple gameplay (ff13) I guess to dumb down the game for the lesser intelligent players? (players like that of kingdom hearts, ranging ages 8-14)

Kingdom Hearts IS creative! It really is a splendid idea to make a vigorous RPG out of beloved Disney characters. But leeching off Final Fantasy characters is distasteful, especially when they try to change things. Who the **** is Aerith?

Well if this is going to go into a debate about the other FF games then we shouldn't talk about it in here.

Really I think Kingdom Hearts didn't "dumb down" anything, I found it quite challenging in some areas, had to level up, equip better weapons. Also I feel that a lot of people who like the Kingdom Hearts series range from 7- 20's maybe even 30's. Also I don't think any FF game since Kingdom Hearts was "dumb down" at all, in fact I found them to be harder than some of the previous Final Fantasy games.

Also Aerith... FFVII, "Aeris" was mistranslated

 

[KillingJoke]

I understand that Kingdom Hearts brought SE a lot of $$$ from marketing to young children instead of teens and adults. But I don't think that Kingdom Hearts supported Final Fantasy itself in any way at all. Kingdom Hearts came out right after X right? Isn't that when Final Fantasy started plundering? I see it that KH changed the market scheme of SE and tried aiming at a broader, more modern audience. With this attempt they tried dispatching online multiplayers and future esque themes with overly simple gameplay (ff13) I guess to dumb down the game for the lesser intelligent players? (players like that of kingdom hearts, ranging ages 8-14)

Kingdom Hearts IS creative! It really is a splendid idea to make a vigorous RPG out of beloved Disney characters. But leeching off Final Fantasy characters is distasteful, especially when they try to change things. Who the **** is Aerith?

I dont think you get the supporting thing, Kingdom Hearts wasnt supporting Final Fantasy, Final Fantasy was supporting Kingdom Hearts thats the only reason they were placed into the game was to get people of the FF franchise to purchase the game and well it worked.

Also the thing about Aerith, if you actually read into it its her true name. The english version of FF7 was translated wrong and therefore is wrong. Every other tie in that has anything to do with FF7 has her as Aerith.

Also im not bashing you just wanna put that out there, people are entitled to their beliefs and opinions so if this is the way you feel then I understand, just trying to add my two cents here and there

 

[Tyler Breeze]

Ehh... Kingdom Hearts is what really got me interested in Final Fantasy. I found the characters to be cool and wanted to learn more about them. Which led me into buying a bunch of Final Fantasy games.

I do think the characters were a bit more... Mellow. But for the most part, they did stay true to character. I wouldn't say butchered, more like... Lightened them up. It made them more appealing to a whole new audience.

 

[mrdaggoth]

Also im not bashing you just wanna put that out there, people are entitled to their beliefs and opinions so if this is the way you feel then I understand, just trying to add my two cents here and there

You are in no way bashing me, because you're using logical sense in your arguement! I love to debate about things like this, this is why I created the post in the first place
The Japanese language doesn't even have a letter or (combination of letters) in their alphabet to pronounce the "th" sound, how could it ever have been 'Aerith', when it was designed in Japan?

 

[Sheechiibii]

You are in no way bashing me, because you're using logical sense in your arguement! I love to debate about things like this, this is why I created the post in the first place
The Japanese language doesn't even have a letter or (combination of letters) in their alphabet to pronounce the "th" sound, how could it ever have been 'Aerith', when it was designed in Japan?

Her name in Japanese is pronounced something like 'Earisu' (relating to earth) - basically the 'su' translates to an English 'th' but because it sounds like an 's' sound they translated it wrong. Everything else spells her name correctly. It was just a mistake. I think that's what happened anyway, but if anyone knows otherwise correct me

 

[Steve-O]

I wouldn't say that kingdom hearts ruined the final fantasy series, it wouldn't help, as I for one recently became more of a kingdom hearts fan than a final fantasy fan. I will however say that Final Fantasy if the reason for Final Fantasy failing, mostly the dragging out of FFXIII, sorry, but western fans hate lightning .

 

[mrdaggoth]

Her name in Japanese is pronounced something like 'Earisu' (relating to earth) - basically the 'su' translates to an English 'th' but because it sounds like an 's' sound they translated it wrong. Everything else spells her name correctly. It was just a mistake. I think that's what happened anyway, but if anyone knows otherwise correct me

But the English version was actually dubbed in Japan by SE producers. How could you assume this was a mistake when it was THEIR game that THEY dubbed themselves? I don't know why they decided to change it in Kingdom Hearts, but to me- Aeris will always be Aeris and Aerith will remain an unexplainable mistake. Perhaps after making a mistake, Square decided to keep the mistaken change to lessen confusion for the new generation of young players?

 

[Shaissa]

But the English version was actually dubbed in Japan by SE producers. How could you assume this was a mistake when it was THEIR game that THEY dubbed themselves? I don't know why they decided to change it in Kingdom Hearts, but to me- Aeris will always be Aeris and Aerith will remain an unexplainable mistake. Perhaps after making a mistake, Square decided to keep the mistaken change to lessen confusion for the new generation of young players?

Have you seen how bad this game was translated in some parts though? It was translated by them yes, but you have to realize that translated from perfect Japanese to English doesn't mean it will be perfect, for they say and use words differently. Also Aerith has been Aerith in everything related to Final Fantasy since the initial release including Crisis Core, Advent Children, On the Wat to Smile (book collection) and Kingdom Hearts.

perfect example

 

[Sheechiibii]

Have you seen how bad this game was translated in some parts though? It was translated by them yes, but you have to realize that translated from perfect Japanese to English doesn't mean it will be perfect, for they say and use words differently. Also Aerith has been Aerith in everything related to Final Fantasy since the initial release including Crisis Core, Advent Children, On the Wat to Smile (book collection) and Kingdom Hearts.

perfect example

Exactly. What people need to remember is that though they are Japanese and so their Japanese will be perfect (you would assume) that doesn't mean they'll always translate things to English perfectly. It really makes no difference whether it was English or Japanese who did the translation, mistakes like this happen all the time, and vii is full of translation errors.

 

[mrdaggoth]

Have you seen how bad this game was translated in some parts though? It was translated by them yes, but you have to realize that translated from perfect Japanese to English doesn't mean it will be perfect, for they say and use words differently. Also Aerith has been Aerith in everything related to Final Fantasy since the initial release including Crisis Core, Advent Children, On the Wat to Smile (book collection) and Kingdom Hearts.

perfect example

This is understandable and I'm aware that game producers often do make mistakes. But the name of one of the main characters in the storyline? Don't you think the game was like spell-checked and proof read at least a dozen times over? Surely they wouldn't happen to "lapse" carelessly over a mistake party members name so many times over. Imagine if Cloud's name was Clpud? That would just not do, lol

 

[Sheechiibii]

This is understandable and I'm aware that game producers often do make mistakes. But the name of one of the main characters in the storyline? Don't you think the game was like spell-checked and proof read at least a dozen times over? Surely they wouldn't happen to "lapse" carelessly over a mistake party members name so many times over. Imagine if Cloud's name was Clpud? That would just not do, lol

But that's the thing, because in Japanese her name ends in a 'su' it probably never crossed their minds that 's' was wrong when they were proof reading, since when you read something you pronounce it in your head. The fact is they never changed her name, they just translated it correctly in every other version. Her name has always been エアリス 'Earisu' which when translated correctly into English is Aerith.

 

[Shaissa]

This is understandable and I'm aware that game producers often do make mistakes. But the name of one of the main characters in the storyline? Don't you think the game was like spell-checked and proof read at least a dozen times over? Surely they wouldn't happen to "lapse" carelessly over a mistake party members name so many times over. Imagine if Cloud's name was Clpud? That would just not do, lol

Anyways before I bring this any farther off topic I shall bring it back on topic by saying this.

Kingdom Hearts has 7 or 8 games (not including remakes), that alone should say that it is its own series now, and the fact that FF characters make random appearances does nothing to either series anymore, now I see FF characters almost like Easter Eggs for the series. Kind of like what some other games did. Borderlands 2 for an example made references to TMNT... Mario.. Donkey Kong... and so many others..

So no Kingdom Hearts didn't ruin Final Fantasy, or "dumb-down" the series, if you don't like the new Final Fantasy games, you can't blame Kingdom Hearts, you blame Final Fantasy creators Square-Enix.

 

[mrdaggoth]

But that's the thing, because in Japanese her name ends in a 'su' it probably never crossed their minds that 's' was wrong when they were proof reading, since when you read something you pronounce it in your head. The fact is they never changed her name, they just translated it correctly in every other version. Her name has always been エアリス 'Earisu' which when translated correctly into English is Aerith.

Aren't Earisu, Aerith and Aeris all names, not actual words? Correct me if i'm wrong, but I don't believe there is a correct or incorrect way to pronounce (or in this case) translate a name. I could be wrong though, this is just what I believe!
Final Fantasy characters are far from easter eggs when it comes to finding them in Kingdom Hearts. Final Fantasy characters being in Kingdom Hearts is probably one of the great huge reasons that Kingdom Hearts sold big time. Final Fantasy helped Kingdom Hearts by practically selling out their characters to the game. Kingdom Hearts gained fans, Final Fantasy lost some- it was a trade, and all for money.

I'm not blaming Kingdom Hearts- the game, just the idea of it.