I just had thought today about the whole Lifestream concept, about how everything returns to the Planet when it dies and how the Planet is alive. The Lifestream is a force that exists in the universe and is a part of everything and in everything. All this sounds almost like Buddism or any of the New Age religions with some hints of Christainity involved but nevertheless can anyone help add to this? Similar concepts are used Xenogears, Final Fantasy X, Kingdom Hearts and Chrono trigger about how everything will one day return from whence it came and how there is a Force that connects us all. I just wonder if anyone else have ideas about this? I an not going to dive too deeply into Metaphysics but all this sounds too interesting to pass up and the Chrono Compendium did it already.
The Metaphysics of FFVII
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I agree, the lifestream concept is a lot like Buddhism and how it has that sort of never-ending wheel of life.. It also has its realistic qualities though, because they say that energy itself can never die. I guess they just sort of added their own thoughts to that.
I've always thought that whoever came up with the idea of 'lifestream' was a real genius. It, I think, is what made FFVII have such a great storyline.
I've always thought that whoever came up with the idea of 'lifestream' was a real genius. It, I think, is what made FFVII have such a great storyline.
I kind of think of it as life on Gaia would never exist without lifestream (because the planet wouldn't exist). The Bible says that Adam was born from the dust of the ground, so when he died, he returned to the earth. I think it's the same concept here (except Cetra can be sentient after death).
The Bible......dont compare the epicness of FFVII with that, Its not the same
thing. l dont know about the Lifestream being never ending because all energy dissipates in the end, eventually the Lifestream will run out if material to create new life and heal the planet.
The fact is the Lifestream is what gives us our vital energy needed to retain our spirit in our bodies, and when that energy is severed through death the human consciousness is returned to the Lifestream it adds the experience of the individual to the whole.
Its not like there is any literature in FFVII that talks about reincarnation or about individuals seeking other bodies after death, so anything we add from earth religions is not fact and is therefore exterior to the Lifestream concept.
(MASSIVE ROUND OF APPLAUSE)
Agreed. Furthermore, I liked how the Materia system tied directly into the plot of the game, and the ethical dilemma the party faced in using Materia. This is why the Materia system is the best character development system in the series IMO; not only does it rock on a technical level, it is very relevent to the plot.
I never saw the concept of lifestream as anything overly spiritual because you see the physical manifestation of it at Mideel, and obviously inside the mako reactors. However, from Bugenhagen's explaination of the life cycles of the planet during your first visit to Cosmo Canyon I guess you can't help but see the religious side to it.
Hmmmm.....Relevant to the plot huh? lve never thought of it like that,
l agree that its probably the best custom/development/level system of the series ,is'nt materia the legacy of the Ancients, so how can the Team have a "moral" problem with using it to save there world?.
With the Ancients gone someone had to step up, and Cloud&Co had no other choice but to use the materia to stop a great evil(Sephiroth) from destroying the planet, just like the ancients would have done.
Materia is the crystalline form of lifestream energy, which I always interpretted to be akin to Mako harvesting on a small scale.
This is why I have always thought it relevent to the plot. Plus, the scenes like the one in the Kalm flashback sequence where Sephiroth explains how materia is formed is great.
This is why I have always thought it relevent to the plot. Plus, the scenes like the one in the Kalm flashback sequence where Sephiroth explains how materia is formed is great.
After the first or second playhtroughs, the story ceases to be interesting to me and i just play for the battles so l suppose that over time the materia system just became a command and level system.
The life stream was always separate from the materia you use to fight monsters becuase not enough is told bout it apart from your trek through the Nible Mountains
The life stream was always separate from the materia you use to fight monsters becuase not enough is told bout it apart from your trek through the Nible Mountains
Clo-bot
electronica dance queen
There's a book, Final Fantasy and Philosophy, that covers this fairly extensively. It has the most amazing cover as well.
Yes thats great I just bought a copy of off Ebay.....but what do you think Kitty-cat??
Tell us your opinion or about the theories in the book......l wonder if the lifestream is applicable on other planets in FFVII universe.....because l cant remember if if bhugenhagen says its a universal entity?
Tell us your opinion or about the theories in the book......l wonder if the lifestream is applicable on other planets in FFVII universe.....because l cant remember if if bhugenhagen says its a universal entity?
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When a person dies their consciousness is added to the lifestream, and everything flows together as one. The lifestream flows into new life when it is born and so it sort of works as a cycle in that respect.
However there is a slight issue created by certain elements of the plot regarding this. Aerith is able to
.
Perhaps all this means is either that there is a period after a person's death where their life energy still retains individual consciousness of people, perhaps until it enters a new life, or perhaps that isn't it at all and everyone's consciousness remains in the lifestream forever working in unison (though distinct and seperate and retaining their personalities) to update the planet with information on what is going on, and that it is merely the life energy that bonded soul and body that is recycled. If I'm making sense there, I'm not sure if I am...
I need to play through those Cosmo Canyon scenes again I think to hear what Bugenhagen says on the subject. I guess it makes sense that soul and energy are seperate, and that energy can still be recycled and a person's soul remain in the lifestream as an individual but working as a collective. Surely it'll get a bit crowded though.
Wow... I just looked for this and I agree the cover is fantastic.
I just checked the contents on Amazon and it looks a very interesting book which I'll definitely get now. Thanks for mentioning this.
However there is a slight issue created by certain elements of the plot regarding this. Aerith is able to
channel the lifestream's energy, and in the short novella I think (though I have not read it) she speaks to those that died in FF7 and convinces them all to help her
Perhaps all this means is either that there is a period after a person's death where their life energy still retains individual consciousness of people, perhaps until it enters a new life, or perhaps that isn't it at all and everyone's consciousness remains in the lifestream forever working in unison (though distinct and seperate and retaining their personalities) to update the planet with information on what is going on, and that it is merely the life energy that bonded soul and body that is recycled. If I'm making sense there, I'm not sure if I am...
I need to play through those Cosmo Canyon scenes again I think to hear what Bugenhagen says on the subject. I guess it makes sense that soul and energy are seperate, and that energy can still be recycled and a person's soul remain in the lifestream as an individual but working as a collective. Surely it'll get a bit crowded though.
Wow... I just looked for this and I agree the cover is fantastic.
I just checked the contents on Amazon and it looks a very interesting book which I'll definitely get now. Thanks for mentioning this.
Clo-bot
electronica dance queen
I always thought the soul was individual, but still part of a collective, though not quite so defined as it was when it was in the body. Like, instead of being conscious, you're just a collection of your past thoughts and memories (does that make sense?). I don't know if Bugenhagen says anything to support this idea though, it's just how I always perceived it. Probably encouraged by Aeris's part.
Speaking of her, I had the impression she was different from other members of the Lifestream, specifically because she was Cetra. Because she had the bond with the Planet, she had some sort of ability to channel the Lifestream, even in death, that others did not. In THAT case, were other Cetra able to do this as well? Though their souls would probably have already been recycled, since most had been gone for quite a long while.
And the book is great! Some articles are weaker than others, but there's an amazing article about FF7 and Japan's history with Shinto and their culture.
Speaking of her, I had the impression she was different from other members of the Lifestream, specifically because she was Cetra. Because she had the bond with the Planet, she had some sort of ability to channel the Lifestream, even in death, that others did not. In THAT case, were other Cetra able to do this as well? Though their souls would probably have already been recycled, since most had been gone for quite a long while.
And the book is great! Some articles are weaker than others, but there's an amazing article about FF7 and Japan's history with Shinto and their culture.
Neo Bahamut
Blue Mage
Clo-Bot: I kind of want to read that book now. Any clue where I can find it?
The Lifestream is largely inspired by the "Gaia Theory," which basically says the entire earth is alive. Near as I can tell, it's a philosophy about how every individual ecosystem affects everything on the planet.
And it DEFINTELY has religious aspects into it. We really can't forget how Maiden alludes to Sephiroth's existance as Hell, or how Sephiroth ressurrects himself, or anything like that.
I would also like to add that the comparisons to a body system have been increased throughout the Compilation. In VII, the term "lifeblood" was used a few times. In Dirge, Lucretia coins the term "terra system," & shows that the Lifestream has all kinds of defenses for different threats to itself. As of Dirge, I think we can safely say that there are other planets with Lifestreams.
As for Aerith, she speculates that it's because she's a Cetra that she manages to retain consciousness, but Sephiroth also does it. Granted, he's not exactly normal, but it's possible that anyone with a strong enough will can do it. The other people retain consciousness because Aerith remembers them & it triggers their own memories.
Lastly, it is explained in the Ultimania that materia has fallen into disuse because it decreases the life energy of the planet. So, yeah, there is an ethical dilemna there.
The Lifestream is largely inspired by the "Gaia Theory," which basically says the entire earth is alive. Near as I can tell, it's a philosophy about how every individual ecosystem affects everything on the planet.
And it DEFINTELY has religious aspects into it. We really can't forget how Maiden alludes to Sephiroth's existance as Hell, or how Sephiroth ressurrects himself, or anything like that.
I would also like to add that the comparisons to a body system have been increased throughout the Compilation. In VII, the term "lifeblood" was used a few times. In Dirge, Lucretia coins the term "terra system," & shows that the Lifestream has all kinds of defenses for different threats to itself. As of Dirge, I think we can safely say that there are other planets with Lifestreams.
As for Aerith, she speculates that it's because she's a Cetra that she manages to retain consciousness, but Sephiroth also does it. Granted, he's not exactly normal, but it's possible that anyone with a strong enough will can do it. The other people retain consciousness because Aerith remembers them & it triggers their own memories.
Lastly, it is explained in the Ultimania that materia has fallen into disuse because it decreases the life energy of the planet. So, yeah, there is an ethical dilemna there.
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Just have a look on ebay its $20-$25 on ebay with BuyItNow.
Its right there to be had .
Yeah and are you not going to use the very thing that could save the planet just because it feels wrong. I don't think so, Desperate times and all that shit.......
when the time comes morals take a back seat when lives are on the line.
Its right there to be had .
Yeah and are you not going to use the very thing that could save the planet just because it feels wrong. I don't think so, Desperate times and all that shit.......
when the time comes morals take a back seat when lives are on the line.