FFX-2 Sin Aeon VS Bevelle's Strongest Machina

Dean Winchester

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Yes, after much reading about Vegnagun and it's capabilities, I've stumbled to the point of deciding if it could be possible for Vegnagun to defeat. Though Sin was the strongest being imaginable, with the ability to destroy a whole city and leave a trail of ruin and destruction with is pass. Sin is impervious to any weapon, as has been proved from time to time. It is also immortal, though its body is destroyed, Yu Yevon is able to summon another Sin by bounding itself to another Final Summoning. This being its greatest strength and also its major weakness, for it depends in another Final Summoning to reborn. Now we have Vegnagun, in theory the strongest and most ancient machina weapon ever built, with a cannon capable of destroying all of Spira. Vegnagun does not depends on anything to exist, yet it depends on someone to control it. Its threatening power comes to the price of not being able to differ from friend or foe, seeing all as enemies. Vegnagun was never used because it was feared that, when Vegnagun fired the cannon, it would also destroy Bevelle and even all of Spira in the process.

It was not built to defeat Sin, it's original purpose was to be used against Zanarkand, but since Zanarkand was destroyed, there was no use to take the risk of unleashing Vegnagun. Now if both creatures were placed face to face, we would have a hard time deciding. Vegnagun's cannon would probably pierce through Sin's armor, shattering it and since Vegnagun is not an aeon, Yu Yevon wouldn't be able to merge with it and thus the chain of death and rebirth would be broken. Still Vegnagun requires to charge it's main cannon, meaning that Sin could attack and possibly prevent the weapon from being fired. Vegnagun's best strategy would be long range combat, but Sin also has a cannon of his own, so it would depend on which one is able to fire the cannon first. But, if both of them were to fire at the same time, now it would only depend on who has the greatest power to push back the energy released by both fiends. In the end, either could win, and both could be destroyed in the process.

Now I would like to know what others think about this topic. If it was discussed already, sorry but I never found the thread :neomon:
 

Casanova

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Well if we cast our minds back to Operation Mi'ihen in FFX, Sin was almost matched by a simpler machina fired by the Al Bhed (the tripod-cannon thingamabob that fired lightning)

If we take this in to consideration and the fact that Vegnagun is the most powerful machina weapon ever built I'd say it's a no contest.

Unless maybe Sin was able to use it's Giga-Graviton attack first, but there's still no certainty that the attack will be able to destroy Vegnagun.
 

Dean Winchester

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Well if we cast our minds back to Operation Mi'ihen in FFX, Sin was almost matched by a simpler machina fired by the Al Bhed (the tripod-cannon thingamabob that fired lightning)

If we take this in to consideration and the fact that Vegnagun is the most powerful machina weapon ever built I'd say it's a no contest.

Unless maybe Sin was able to use it's Giga-Graviton attack first, but there's still no certainty that the attack will be able to destroy Vegnagun.
Yes, because even if Sin does shots "Giga Graviton", there's still a possibility that Vegnagun might endure the attack, and by then Vegnagun's energy cannon would be fully charged and ready to be fired. If that Al Bhed Cannon Prototype was good enough to give Sin a hard time to shield, then Vegnagun's powerful cannon would, without a doubt, pierce through it. It has the ability to destroy all of Spira with that cannon, so destroying Sin with it won't be much trouble.
 

Dark-Angel

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personally i think Vegnagun has the most strength overall, yet Sin has the most strength in his one powerful attack. remeber what happened when Sin used the "Giga Graviton" thing. the earth was obliterated. Even the fucking water was moved. Then at the end...everything exploded...the whole planet was affected.

Yet, Vegnagun hasn't been used in about 1000 years. Its rusty so to speak. So its powers are therefore devolved from its old capabilities. In the end, man made vegnagun

Me. i think Sin would win.
 

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remeber what happened when Sin used the "Giga Graviton" thing. the earth was obliterated. Even the fucking water was moved. Then at the end...everything exploded...the whole planet was affected.

You do know Earth is the planet that we live on, right?

Sin was only able to destroy Zanarkand, not the whole of Spira.

Sin may have the power to destroy the whole of Spira in one fell swoop but in this case the war was between Bevelle and Zanarkand, not Bevelle and the rest of Spira, therefore only Zanarkand was destroyed.
 

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I think one factor that might affect Sin's power is which Sin it actually is. Remember in X the Sin at that time was Jecht, and he had his weaknesses that former Sins would not have had. I'm not sure even Yuna and co would have stood a chance if it hadn't have been for Jecht being partial to the Hymn of the Fayth, which they used to calm him and enter him to destroy him. In fact when you fight Sin I think a lot of his attacks were probably weaker because of Jecht's consciousness.

I think an earlier Sin would have been more of a challenge for Vegnagun.
 

Saix

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Yes, because even if Sin does shots "Giga Graviton", there's still a possibility that Vegnagun might endure the attack, and by then Vegnagun's energy cannon would be fully charged and ready to be fired. If that Al Bhed Cannon Prototype was good enough to give Sin a hard time to shield, then Vegnagun's powerful cannon would, without a doubt, pierce through it. It has the ability to destroy all of Spira with that cannon, so destroying Sin with it won't be much trouble.
I wouldn't go as far as saying Vegnagun could endure Giga-Graviton. We see the extent of said magic's destructive capability as it decimates the areas it touches literally on contact - baring in mind that Vegnagun, no matter how big its cannon is or gargantuan his stature may be, he's still only nuts, bolts and pieces of metal. As Rikku says: "it's still just a machina".

Granted, both Vegnagun's cannon and Sin's ultimate attack seem to take forever to charge up, but Sin doesn't need to rely on his Graviton magic to deal immense damage.

I strongly believe that Vegnagun would lose essentially all appendages and offensive capabilities during the time it's charging up.
 

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You do know Earth is the planet that we live on, right?

Sin was only able to destroy Zanarkand, not the whole of Spira.

Sin may have the power to destroy the whole of Spira in one fell swoop but in this case the war was between Bevelle and Zanarkand, not Bevelle and the rest of Spira, therefore only Zanarkand was destroyed.

I think he might have meant the effect Sin had on Spira during one of the final cutscenes in FFX when the group faced Sin. The scene where they showed an outer space look at what was happening, very "Day After Tomorrow". At least, that's the interpretation I got from him. The preparation of that attack was able to change the weather of the planet in a substantial way.

I don't have too much to say really since I haven't beaten FFX-2. Close though, I'm just anal and refuse to get anything loser than 100%. I suppose what was said earlier about Vegnagun being rusty would be true. I don't see how the most powerful machina ever created would lose to three scrawny girls. I'm playing it through again though, so hopefully I'll win.
 

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I think he might have meant the effect Sin had on Spira during one of the final cutscenes in FFX when the group faced Sin. The scene where they showed an outer space look at what was happening, very "Day After Tomorrow". At least, that's the interpretation I got from him. The preparation of that attack was able to change the weather of the planet in a substantial way.

I don't have too much to say really since I haven't beaten FFX-2. Close though, I'm just anal and refuse to get anything loser than 100%. I suppose what was said earlier about Vegnagun being rusty would be true. I don't see how the most powerful machina ever created would lose to three scrawny girls. I'm playing it through again though, so hopefully I'll win.
Because the game designers of FFX-2 were amazingly retarded, hence why FFX-2 was the greatest failure of all Final Fantasy games, only matched by Final Fantasy: The Spirit Within.
 

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lets compare the hp of the two beasts
vegnaguns total hp is
219480(that is counting the three nodes in the leg)

sins total hp is
306000(not counting sinspawn genais
or braskas final aeon)

also note that if the two beasts were fighting to see who was the best vegnagun would not use its cannon because if he used it he would destoy him self

so all in all suposing that they took turns dealing 9999 damage to each other sin would win

also sin could reduce vegnaguns hp by 3/4 just by using graviga
 
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Dark Tidus

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Ouch... I think you owned all the competition... But you have to agree that Vegnagun would be immune to Gravity. Even with that advantage though Sin still wins by 1/3 of his HP.
 

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Not to mention that sin wouldn't have to take out the nodes in vagnaguns leg. Thats 90,000 less hp to take down, so now vegnagun only has 129480 hp. And dark tidus your right vegnagun is immune to gravity so graviga would be usless.
 

Dean Winchester

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We can't base our discussion in Game Mechanics because that would also mean that Seifer is stronger than Squall because he has more HP, that Sephiroth is stronger than Cloud because he has more HP (Also the Ultimania points that Sephiroth is stronger anyway), that Vayne is stronger than Vaan and the rest of his party because Vayne has more HP.

Out of game mechanics, I believe that the battle would most likely end up in a draw.
 

zidane

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Another good point Dark Tidus because that if sin is going to destroy somthing it is going to be complete about it, no left overs, but if I still count the nodes should count sinpawn genais, or a final aeon?
 
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Dark Tidus

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No because they're on the inside. You'd have to count the infinite monsters Inside Sin as well if you did that.

And JA has a point but in those games all the people you are pointing out have multiple different attacks and healing abilities as well as items.

Vegnagun and Sin both can only hit 9999 max with any attack, can't heal, and have no items, the battle can work on game mechanics. Plus if you're going to throw all the mechanics in there you need to add luck, evasion, defense, magic defense, and MP, as well as any other stats that would matter in that fight. That would make the battle too unpredictable as well as impossible to decide, so we have to stick with Zidane's idea.
 

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Has my post been completely ignored? Clearly Giga-Graviton is an adequate skill to eliminate Vegnagun and all its offensive appendages. Should this attack not be taken in to account, what of Sin's barrage against Dream Zanarkand? Did that not completely destroy anything the blasted energy touched?

Vegnagun had one attack which could cause such damage, and that took forever and a day to load. No matter how it's viewed, Vegnagun wouldn't stand a hope in Hell of winning.
 

Dark Tidus

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Giga-Graviton took long enough for 3 people to knock off 306,000. I think that's longer than Vegnaguns attack and Vegnagun would be able to use it if Sin decided to start with Giga-Graviton, if not Vegnagun would be destroyed first.
 

zidane

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but sin didn't start charging until after it fell on bevelle, so the heroes only had to take down 140000 hp, but Dark Tidus and Dr. Cid are right both giga-gravitation and vegnaguns cannon take long enough time to charge that one would be dead before eigher attack went off
 
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