Advent Children Nanaki

Prometheus

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I didn't see a thread about this so here goes.
Okay so i was just watching Advent Children earlier..... at the very beginning when Nanaki and the 2 others of his tribe are running and bound up the cliff... I thought that Nanaki was the last of his kind... so where did these other 2 come from?
 

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That part is actually 500 years after the events of FF7, so presumably they are Red's offspring.

Argor and I were having a similar discussion in the SB last night. Red's character is incredibly underdeveloped in the FF7 afterworks, so it's difficult to pinpoint exactly how he managed to reproduce. But if I had to take a wild stab in the dark, I'd say either the female member of his tribe that he was protecting (in Crisis Core I think?) didn't actually get killed and they reconnected later, and/or Hojo created another in his lab. Or of course there's the boring explanation where there are other members of his tribe, they're just in hiding or some such.
 

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I'd quite like this to be explained in a Red XIII based game, anime or even a movie... As opposed to seeing Cloud, Zack and Sephiroth's storylines expanded. Nanaki actually has a lot that is left unknown.

For now though we really can't be sure. Perhaps he met somehow with survivors of his tribe who perhaps had been either in hiding, or in captivity somewhere. If not, then perhaps he had somehow had himself cloned (crazy theory, don't listen to it). Another possibility is that Nanaki's race can actually interbreed with humans, suggested as possible by
Hojo trying to mate Nanaki and Aerith together
upon first meeting him... However that is more likely to have been down to Hojo being insane testing things about than actually being able to produce offspring like that.

It's much more likely that he found a mate, a survivor of his tribe, and then had kids. Like Cassino said that clip with his children happened 500 years later, when Nanaki is a bit older and his kids will be pretty young. His race has a very long lifespan, so there is a LONG time before he has these kids.

It was originally the ending of FF7 before it became the intro sequence to Advent Children, and I guess it makes more sense being at the end of FF7 (signfying how life goes on on the planet, and letting the player know that in 500 years time Nanaki is still rocking) than it did at the begining of Advent Children (where it only served the purpose of getting us excited, and is actually one of my favourite scenes of the movie).
 
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Prometheus

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That part is actually 500 years after the events of FF7, so presumably they are Red's offspring.

Argor and I were having a similar discussion in the SB last night. Red's character is incredibly underdeveloped in the FF7 afterworks, so it's difficult to pinpoint exactly how he managed to reproduce. But if I had to take a wild stab in the dark, I'd say either the female member of his tribe that he was protecting (in Crisis Core I think?) didn't actually get killed and they reconnected later, and/or Hojo created another in his lab. Or of course there's the boring explanation where there are other members of his tribe, they're just in hiding or some such.
Aye, i understand partially what your saying... but unless i am mistaken ( kinda likely) wasn't there a reference in FFVII of Nanaki saying that he was the last of his kind, and if it is set 500 years in the Future.... Wouldn't one assume that even if there were survivors.. they would have long died off?
 

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wasnt it set 3 yrs in the future? i thaught marlene said it was...
 

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He said that the beginning part was set 500 years in the future, so im assuming the rest of the movie was set just like you said 3 years into the future
 

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oh, and just out of curiousity, how did we get to the conclusion of it being that far in the future??? sorry im just a bit confused now...
 

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Perhaps SE has a bio about it saying that it is in fact that far set into the future... thats just my guess... i have no actual idea if it is correct.
 

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well my theory was always just the magic of tv, anything can happen, me an my sis put too much thatught into it and had no conclusions...so i cant be of too much help other than nobody said they were HIS offspring...maybe they only wanted to throw something unexpected in...
 

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Well I think he probably did say that he was the last of his kind, and he probably believed it himself. It's not made completely clear in the game what happened to the rest of his tribe.

And about dying off... They have a very long lifespan... So if we are to assume that some members of the species had survived, then it is reasonable that they are still alive in 500 years time if Nanaki himself is seen to be (he is about the equivalent of a young man / late teenager in FF7, despite already being quite old in human years).


And 500 years is correct. I think it tells you in the original game just before it shows the cutscene, and in the movie I belieive it also has the numbers on the screen. It's also on FF Wikia if you want to check (just checked to be double-sure).
 

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right come to think of it, he only did know his parents died, never really got on the subject of all the others,, and my question is, why dont we ever see the mother??
 

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I think the larger question is "why don't we see any references to any other member of his species other than Nanaki's father, Seto?".

His mother isn't explained much. I think she might be mentioned in one or two lines when he talks about his father (he mentions that she died shortly after his father I think, from a broken heart or something), but that is it.

The whole race seems to have up and vanished. It's not made clear at all what the war with the Gi Tribe was about, and where that pass led to, who the Gi Tribe were... Only that
Seto defended Cosmo Canyon from them and died in the effort, along with the Gi Tribe. His efforts allowed Nanaki's race to escape and survive (along with the human inhabitants of Cosmo Canyon),
but god knows what happened to the rest after that.

Apparantly Before Crisis had another of Nanaki's species in it... A female called Deneh, and that when Nanaki was captured by Shinra she was able to get away and hasn't been seen since. Perhaps this is his future mate?

Other than that, we're left to imagine.. Until they make something else to carry on Nanaki's story.
 

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well i never did play before crisis...well when u threw that out there, i pretty much do think that was his future mate...it makes sense, i mean if we dont know what happened to her, then the charecters in the story probly dont know either and nanaki must have met her in the future
 

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Aye, i agree.. the way that you put it is that they ere together before Nanaki was taken, so it leads me to believe that after Nanaki escaped and what not (after helping Cloud (Regular FFVII)) he set out to find this 'Deneh' you spoke of and maybe she had found other's of their tribe or maybe they were the last known surivors, i don't think that question will be answered... maybe.
 

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Flash from the past, but I think it was worth opening up due to the fact that Nanaki (Red XIII) is one of my fav FF Characters all time).
We will probably find more information regarding this in future parts of FF7 Remakes. the game is a lot more detailed than the original.
I'm also praying for either a DLC like Yuffie has right now or even better a prolonged Final Fantasy 7 Game. one that goes beyond the original.
in a way, this already is, it's not just a remake but more like FF 7.2.

One point that came to mind is, what if Nanaki's Tribe is Parthenogenesis. I mean he had a mom and dad so that kinda breaks that rule as well but maybe his race lives in small packs where each individual assumes a parental role. It's just a thought but it could be out there.

and maybe they aren't his children but rather clones of himself, as Hojo did experiment on him a lot since he can easily reach 500 years. maybe he has wondered the world after all the original crew of FF7 has long passed. and maybe in his travels stumbled onto a secret lab of Hojo. FF7 had some extra secrets labs installed into the game so who knows.
 

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Flash from the past, but I think it was worth opening up due to the fact that Nanaki (Red XIII) is one of my fav FF Characters all time).
We will probably find more information regarding this in future parts of FF7 Remakes. the game is a lot more detailed than the original.
I'm also praying for either a DLC like Yuffie has right now or even better a prolonged Final Fantasy 7 Game. one that goes beyond the original.
in a way, this already is, it's not just a remake but more like FF 7.2.

One point that came to mind is, what if Nanaki's Tribe is Parthenogenesis. I mean he had a mom and dad so that kinda breaks that rule as well but maybe his race lives in small packs where each individual assumes a parental role. It's just a thought but it could be out there.

and maybe they aren't his children but rather clones of himself, as Hojo did experiment on him a lot since he can easily reach 500 years. maybe he has wondered the world after all the original crew of FF7 has long passed. and maybe in his travels stumbled onto a secret lab of Hojo. FF7 had some extra secrets labs installed into the game so who knows.

I know more now than I did back in 2009 (and dumped many of my thoughts here, but since then I've learned even more). I think the fandom in general knows more now too. The content from Before Crisis is quite critical here. It establishes his relationship with his potential mate, Deneh, and the species' role at Cosmo Canyon and their involvement in a ritual to appease the Planet every fifty years (which they complete as a pair). It is presumed that Deneh still exists somewhere. At some point in the future they must be reunited and have their children. 500 years later is quite a wait though...

I don't believe that Nanaki's species reproduced with parthenogenesis, but their numbers are definitely very low. There might not even be enough of them to form a 'pack'. Their population numbers might have always been low, and they might not actually spend very long together (in human years), but they are, it seems, in a worse state now than they had been in the past. Other than Deneh and Nanaki, there might not be any other members of his species left out there. If they had the ability to create new cubs without sexual reproduction then they might not have found themselves in the position that they are currently in. Unless they are like the Phoenix and one generation replaces the other upon death every 500 years. Maybe Nanaki's species literally passes on the torch (of their tails) or something. If so, we know there are at least two of the species active at a time (a male and a female) which still makes parthenogenesis unlikely, I think. The species certainly has its quirks though.

I should expect we shall definitely a proper expansion of Nanaki's story in Part 2 of the Remake (depending on how they divide this project up). I think we'll probably have a lot of new additions at the beginning of Part 2 to build up his character because Cosmo Canyon is quite a long wait. We might even see some expansion or revision in one of the Ever Crisis episodes. Since Before Crisis isn't exactly accessible, that could be a way of keeping players in the loop again.

EDIT - Your idea about the cloning of Red XIII is interesting. I suspect that one of the reasons we don't see other members of his species in the original game is because of precisely that. Originally it was planned for Hojo to clone/create/alter copies of Nanaki or other members of Nanaki's species. They were to have different colours and numbers in their names and would have also had different colour fur to match their names. Nanaki would have to fight them periodically. The idea was dropped early on though.
 
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