the.forbidden.materia
New member
hey there everyone!! After recently beating FF8 (remarkable experience by the way) my brain can't help but jump to and endless stream of possibilities for how the story actually ended....
late in the game, Rinoa becomes a sorceress, I've seen some theorize that Ultimecia is actually Rinoa from a different timeline where she lost squall, and due to GF causing brain/memory, she likely feel into deep despair in which her sorceress powers were manipulated by this "broken" rinoa in that timeline....I could see this being a possibility since Ultimecia summons the GF Griever, which is squalls totem, possibility hinting they have a connection...
The ending of the game shows squall with Edea as Ultimecia gives her the sorceress powers, in turn, squalls tells Edea about Garden and SeeD, assuming this is an attempt to create a timeline in the past where society has a specific military collective to combat sorceress (which is successful as we obviously see as thats a main plot point of the game....)
is it through the transference of Ultimecias powers given to Edea that she is later able to mind control Edea through the future? If so, then does that mean that Ultimecia had this as a backup plan for if she was defeated? Sorceress powers MUST be passed on, and Edea (from the past) gladly makes the sacrifice
Ultimecia, being from the future, doesn't that mean that she IS in fact a descendant of Rinoa who has passesd on her powers to future individuals?
While I have no way or justifiably proving this entirely....something tells me that Ultimecia is forcing time compression to happen, as a sort of "Devils Advocate" circumstance.... as a way to force all timelines into one where she exists with the sorceress powers, though the person responsible for giving it to her no longer exists in a past timeline...essentially ending the powers of the sorceresses forever? (its a stretch i know....
Is Ultimecia trying to destroy herself along with the powers of the sorceress, from the future by manipulating the past?
IF ultimecia gave her powers to Edea, does that mean every event that transpired throughout the game would essentially only repeat itself because "defeating" ultimecia set in motion a wave of events that leads to Edea becoming her sucessor and Garden/SeeD being born by Squall telling Edea from the past to create it...?
The party destroyed Adel as a way to force ultimecia to posses Rinoa from the future, and thanks to the help of Ellone the party is able to enter a window to travel to the future where Ultimecia exists and destroy her there....
The game ends with Rinoa crying with unconscious Squall, is it through her Sorceress powers that she was able to place herself and him into the timeline they originally came from?
If the now-defeated-ultimecia-from-the-future transfers her powers to Edea in the past, which was mentioned earlier on during the main story....doesn't that mean, squall and everyone defeating her in the future is something that has [already] happened in this timeline...? The only reason I could imagine as to why Squall and the others have no memory of that detail is that the GF's they use damage their brain/memory so have no memory of the event
Ellone is easily the strongest variable in this complicated situation, because it is through Ellones powers that squall and everyone is able to travel to the timeline future where Ultimecia exists, who simultaneously is accessing the past through the machine created by doctor Odine, which was inspired to replicate Ellones psychic powers....
While the game ends with everyone back in their correct timeline and future-ultimecia defeated and now given her powers to Edea in the past....the group has defeated FUTURE ultimecia, but the sorceress powers, technologies, and individuals used by the future-ultimecia still exist....doesn't that mean the girl who will eventually receive the sorceress powers and eventually become ultimecia still [exists] as a possibility in the timeline we exist in now....
these are simply ideas, brain vomits, theories, and complicated perspectives that have run through my mind as the game has ended...while not every question could potentially be answered, it's fun to explore these ideas, even though they are not official/canon
thanks for reading!!
***
Considering Ultimecias perspective:....she is attempting to save herself from being killed by SeeD by manipulating the past....knowing this, she has every right protect herself. It's not uncommon for Sorceresses to be hated by society, which seems unfair because each Sorceress is forced into this position by the previous Sorceress transfering her powers onto the next woman. They are not related by blood, they are chosen by their magical affinity, so essentially chosen at random.....
In Ultimecias present time (the future in regards to us) she is able to manipulate the past through the machine created by Doctor Odine....is it possible that Ultimecia is able to look into limitless numbers of timelines, all of which will eventually end in her being murdered by SeeD due to society terrorizing her into a monster due to her unwanted powers. she never asked for or wanted....If the only outcome is her being murdered by SeeD, her motive to compress time into a singularity isn't motivated by malice, but y fear and desperation to not be murdered....attempting to remove anyone who might harm her, shes attempting to create a timeline where she can exist in peace.....her motives, though very loosely explained throughout the game, can be more deeply examined through the timeline paradoxes that exist through her manipulaton....
Ultimecia, was NEVER evil, if it appear that she is motivated by malice and domination, it is a RESULT of the society in which she grew up in mistreating her and forcing her into isolation due to her powers that she never asked for....Ultimecia is FORCED into being a villan, helplessly and desperately manipulating multiple timelines to create a reality where she is free and able to live her life without harm or shame....
If Ultimecias goal was to manipulate the past from the future, one could argue that Ultimecia is attempting to force-stop the continuation of the sorceress line by allowing time compression to occur and create a singular timeline where only she exists....she will no longer be murdered and no one will receive her sorceress powers as there will be no other timeline that exists where a woman can receive her powers....
In theoretical conclusion: Ultimecia from the future attempts to manipulate the past in order to save herself from the timeline where she is murdered by SeeD. If ultimecia KNEW squall would eventually defeat her, isn't her death more of a willing suicide. Squall and everyone else did the very thing that ultimecia knew would eventually happen. While [the future] timeline where ultimecia exists to create a singularity as a way to save herself, the timeline where she eventually becomes chosen to be a sorceress still exists. If SeeD [only] exists to combat sorceresses, Rinoa is an unfortunate piece of a larger puzzle that will eventually lead to Ultimecia doing the same exact thing.....Ultimecia knows this endless timeloop only repeats her being hunted and killed by SeeD, so ultimecia -if she had succeded- would have essentially saved the world by forcing herself to be the final sorceress, and removing timelines where violence against her and her predecessors exists.....
late in the game, Rinoa becomes a sorceress, I've seen some theorize that Ultimecia is actually Rinoa from a different timeline where she lost squall, and due to GF causing brain/memory, she likely feel into deep despair in which her sorceress powers were manipulated by this "broken" rinoa in that timeline....I could see this being a possibility since Ultimecia summons the GF Griever, which is squalls totem, possibility hinting they have a connection...
The ending of the game shows squall with Edea as Ultimecia gives her the sorceress powers, in turn, squalls tells Edea about Garden and SeeD, assuming this is an attempt to create a timeline in the past where society has a specific military collective to combat sorceress (which is successful as we obviously see as thats a main plot point of the game....)
is it through the transference of Ultimecias powers given to Edea that she is later able to mind control Edea through the future? If so, then does that mean that Ultimecia had this as a backup plan for if she was defeated? Sorceress powers MUST be passed on, and Edea (from the past) gladly makes the sacrifice
Ultimecia, being from the future, doesn't that mean that she IS in fact a descendant of Rinoa who has passesd on her powers to future individuals?
While I have no way or justifiably proving this entirely....something tells me that Ultimecia is forcing time compression to happen, as a sort of "Devils Advocate" circumstance.... as a way to force all timelines into one where she exists with the sorceress powers, though the person responsible for giving it to her no longer exists in a past timeline...essentially ending the powers of the sorceresses forever? (its a stretch i know....
Is Ultimecia trying to destroy herself along with the powers of the sorceress, from the future by manipulating the past?
IF ultimecia gave her powers to Edea, does that mean every event that transpired throughout the game would essentially only repeat itself because "defeating" ultimecia set in motion a wave of events that leads to Edea becoming her sucessor and Garden/SeeD being born by Squall telling Edea from the past to create it...?
The party destroyed Adel as a way to force ultimecia to posses Rinoa from the future, and thanks to the help of Ellone the party is able to enter a window to travel to the future where Ultimecia exists and destroy her there....
The game ends with Rinoa crying with unconscious Squall, is it through her Sorceress powers that she was able to place herself and him into the timeline they originally came from?
If the now-defeated-ultimecia-from-the-future transfers her powers to Edea in the past, which was mentioned earlier on during the main story....doesn't that mean, squall and everyone defeating her in the future is something that has [already] happened in this timeline...? The only reason I could imagine as to why Squall and the others have no memory of that detail is that the GF's they use damage their brain/memory so have no memory of the event
Ellone is easily the strongest variable in this complicated situation, because it is through Ellones powers that squall and everyone is able to travel to the timeline future where Ultimecia exists, who simultaneously is accessing the past through the machine created by doctor Odine, which was inspired to replicate Ellones psychic powers....
While the game ends with everyone back in their correct timeline and future-ultimecia defeated and now given her powers to Edea in the past....the group has defeated FUTURE ultimecia, but the sorceress powers, technologies, and individuals used by the future-ultimecia still exist....doesn't that mean the girl who will eventually receive the sorceress powers and eventually become ultimecia still [exists] as a possibility in the timeline we exist in now....
these are simply ideas, brain vomits, theories, and complicated perspectives that have run through my mind as the game has ended...while not every question could potentially be answered, it's fun to explore these ideas, even though they are not official/canon
thanks for reading!!
***
Considering Ultimecias perspective:....she is attempting to save herself from being killed by SeeD by manipulating the past....knowing this, she has every right protect herself. It's not uncommon for Sorceresses to be hated by society, which seems unfair because each Sorceress is forced into this position by the previous Sorceress transfering her powers onto the next woman. They are not related by blood, they are chosen by their magical affinity, so essentially chosen at random.....
In Ultimecias present time (the future in regards to us) she is able to manipulate the past through the machine created by Doctor Odine....is it possible that Ultimecia is able to look into limitless numbers of timelines, all of which will eventually end in her being murdered by SeeD due to society terrorizing her into a monster due to her unwanted powers. she never asked for or wanted....If the only outcome is her being murdered by SeeD, her motive to compress time into a singularity isn't motivated by malice, but y fear and desperation to not be murdered....attempting to remove anyone who might harm her, shes attempting to create a timeline where she can exist in peace.....her motives, though very loosely explained throughout the game, can be more deeply examined through the timeline paradoxes that exist through her manipulaton....
Ultimecia, was NEVER evil, if it appear that she is motivated by malice and domination, it is a RESULT of the society in which she grew up in mistreating her and forcing her into isolation due to her powers that she never asked for....Ultimecia is FORCED into being a villan, helplessly and desperately manipulating multiple timelines to create a reality where she is free and able to live her life without harm or shame....
If Ultimecias goal was to manipulate the past from the future, one could argue that Ultimecia is attempting to force-stop the continuation of the sorceress line by allowing time compression to occur and create a singular timeline where only she exists....she will no longer be murdered and no one will receive her sorceress powers as there will be no other timeline that exists where a woman can receive her powers....
In theoretical conclusion: Ultimecia from the future attempts to manipulate the past in order to save herself from the timeline where she is murdered by SeeD. If ultimecia KNEW squall would eventually defeat her, isn't her death more of a willing suicide. Squall and everyone else did the very thing that ultimecia knew would eventually happen. While [the future] timeline where ultimecia exists to create a singularity as a way to save herself, the timeline where she eventually becomes chosen to be a sorceress still exists. If SeeD [only] exists to combat sorceresses, Rinoa is an unfortunate piece of a larger puzzle that will eventually lead to Ultimecia doing the same exact thing.....Ultimecia knows this endless timeloop only repeats her being hunted and killed by SeeD, so ultimecia -if she had succeded- would have essentially saved the world by forcing herself to be the final sorceress, and removing timelines where violence against her and her predecessors exists.....
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