Deportation For Illegal Aliens Who Are Parents of U.S Citizen Minors - Page 2

July 3, 2008, 2:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by δ Kuja Ω

I think you have a big heart, but your making your decision a little too much on emotion, and your forgetting about a few things...

It is sad, and I dont think anyone is going to say it isn't. But in America we have laws, letting him stay isn't fair to the people who endured the task of getting citizenship. Sending him back while being sad is the fair thing to do.

Plus why is forcing somebody back to where they came from sad and terrible, it is the persons home-country were talking about here!

- Kuja

All those poor souls who 'endured' getting citizenship, it's such a tough thing to do.
Wait, it's not.
The amount of immigrants let in is based on a quota system, it is anything but fair, so why should the few lucky enough to get citizenship be given this special status.
As you probably know, South American countries aren't exactly safe, there are far fewer job opportunities and the standard of living is not even close to that of the US.
As they are illegal citizens, we can assume they would prefer to stay in America.
It's a victimless crime, there are no potential benefits to deporting him. Surely there must be other reasons for deporting him than "It's the law". As it is circular logic and just xenaphobia.

July 3, 2008, 7:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Placebo

All those poor souls who 'endured' getting citizenship, it's such a tough thing to do.
Wait, it's not.
The amount of immigrants let in is based on a quota system, it is anything but fair, so why should the few lucky enough to get citizenship be given this special status.
As you probably know, South American countries aren't exactly safe, there are far fewer job opportunities and the standard of living is not even close to that of the US.
As they are illegal citizens, we can assume they would prefer to stay in America.
It's a victimless crime, there are no potential benefits to deporting him. Surely there must be other reasons for deporting him than "It's the law". As it is circular logic and just xenaphobia.

Lol, Ok ill play your little game =)

First of all to say that all South American countries aren't safe is generalizing. Your also generalizing in the sense that your assuming all of these illegals come from South America, and also that their all hispanic! D:! I'm not sure if you've ever lived anywhere in South America, but if you have and claim it wasn't safe, that doesnt mean everywhere else is also.

The number 1 illegal immigrant to the U.S are the Irish, not hispanics.

On a side note, Ill post some statistical data: Theres 21 million illegal immigrants out of those 21 million, 684,000 are fugitives, also 10 Million have taken away SKILLED JOBS(bolded for emphasis ). So clearly its not as "victim-less" as you so naively put it, theres some other stuff like I just felt too lazy to post on the link below, you should check it out, it has some interesting stuff.

My data was from: http://immigrationcounters.com/.
This article also sums up my stance on illegal immigration, read it por favor. http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/bg1913.cfm

Now before you go off claiming citizinship is zomgeasy to get take this test, be truthful to yourself and don't cheat, if you do bad, I wont think of you as any less american XD. http://usgovinfo.about.com/blinstst.htm.

Was nice debating with you. Never been called or accused of being a xenophobic, in fact im quite surprised you went that far . Btw its Xenophobia, Xenaphobia refers to someone who has a fear of Xena Warrior Princess XD. Not everyone who opposes I.I is xenophobic

- Kuja

July 4, 2008, 1:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by δ Kuja Ω

Lol, Ok ill play your little game =)

First of all to say that all South American countries aren't safe is generalizing. Your also generalizing in the sense that your assuming all of these illegals come from South America, and also that their all hispanic! D:! I'm not sure if you've ever lived anywhere in South America, but if you have and claim it wasn't safe, that doesnt mean everywhere else is also.

Okay, we'll play my game shall we?
Latin America and South America aren't safe.
http://laii.unm.edu/conference/mesquita.php
Where are the Medellin cartel and the Cali cartel come from? South America.
Howsabout MS-13? South America, but we could say Latin America instead, I'll let you choose.

Quote:

The number 1 illegal immigrant to the U.S are the Irish, not hispanics.

I'm not sure if you read the OP, if you did, you'd know that the man being deported is hispanic. Therefore your attempt to play the race card fails. Furthermore, Ireland isn't exactly safe. The IRA do make life 'difficult' for people.

Quote:

On a side note, Ill post some statistical data: Theres 21 million illegal immigrants out of those 21 million, 684,000 are fugitives, also 10 Million have taken away SKILLED JOBS(bolded for emphasis ). So clearly its not as "victim-less" as you so naively put it, theres some other stuff like I just felt too lazy to post on the link below, you should check it out, it has some interesting stuff.

If they had be taken by citizens, would you care? No, so this works on the assumption that citizens are inherently more deserving than immigrants. Also. it's a fallacy as jobs are given to the best applicant, so if the jobs would have gone to others anyway. However if you were going to say it is because they can pay them less, then the business is breaking the law and would have been closed down anyway, so no jobs are lost.
Jobs arguement fails, though it was a nice try.

Quote:

My data was from: http://immigrationcounters.com/.
This article also sums up my stance on illegal immigration, read it por favor. http://www.heritage.org/Research/Immigration/bg1913.cfm

Now before you go off claiming citizinship is zomgeasy to get take this test, be truthful to yourself and don't cheat, if you do bad, I wont think of you as any less american XD. http://usgovinfo.about.com/blinstst.htm.

Wow some nice conservative sources you have there. It's a pity though that they are biased, and lacking in credibilty.
Also I don't like to brag, but I got all of those questions right, well except the ones about who my senators are etc. I suppose that can be forgiven, considering I'm not American and I don't live in America. But do feel free to consider me less American if it floats your boat.

Quote:

Was nice debating with you. Never been called or accused of being a xenophobic, in fact im quite surprised you went that far . Btw its Xenophobia, Xenaphobia refers to someone who has a fear of Xena Warrior Princess XD. Not everyone who opposes I.I is xenophobic

Oh wow, I was drinking and I made one mistake. However as I'm nice I won't rip your grammar to shreds, as I like a challenge so gtfoplzkthnx

Nice of you to make it look like I everyone of xenophobia, but I didn't, Your attempts to portray my arguements as generalisations fails in general. So please try again.

July 4, 2008, 2:05 AM

Before you read this Placebo I want you to take a big deep breath.

I guess you can't have debates without people getting pissed off for no reason >.>.

Quote:

I'm not sure if you read the OP, if you did, you'd know that the man being deported is hispanic. Therefore your attempt to play the race card fails. Furthermore, Ireland isn't exactly safe. The IRA do make life 'difficult' for people.

Dont insult my intelligence, of course i read the OP's story, why the hell do you think I gave a similiar story regarding an old friend of mine?

Quote:

If they had be taken by citizens, would you care? No, so this works on the assumption that citizens are inherently more deserving than immigrants. Also. it's a fallacy as jobs are given to the best applicant, so if the jobs would have gone to others anyway. However if you were going to say it is because they can pay them less, then the business is breaking the law and would have been closed down anyway, so no jobs are lost.
Jobs arguement fails, though it was a nice try.

Trying again to portray me a racist? I do believe that people who deserve the job should get it. Your statement about "This works on the assumption..blah..blah" is a loaded statement. Citizens and LEGAL immigrants are equally deserving, you failed to add that in a pathetic attempt to portray me as a racist which i clearly am not. I understand where your coming from, but what your saying is ridicolous. And I do agree, the job stealing arguement isnt a good one, i put it in there to see how you'd respond, obviously with hostility.

Quote:

Wow some nice conservative sources you have there. It's a pity though that they are biased, and lacking in credibilty.
Also I don't like to brag, but I got all of those questions right, well except the ones about who my senators are etc. I suppose that can be forgiven, considering I'm not American and I don't live in America. But do feel free to consider me less American if it floats your boat.

Ahh the good ol source arguement, if they were a liberal source would it make it less bias, or less lacking in credibility? Again I wasn't attacking your character by saying "I won't think of you as any more american", i was joking around, learn to take a joke man =/. And if you got all the questions right, then good for you.

Quote:

Oh wow, I was drinking and I made one mistake. However as I'm nice I won't rip your grammar to shreds, as I like a challenge so gtfoplzkthnx

Nice of you to make it look like I everyone of xenophobia, but I didn't, Your attempts to portray my arguements as generalisations fails in general. So please try again.

Dude seriously you need to take a chill pill, you turned a perfectly innocent response from me into something it wasn't. I was merely pointing out you made a mistake, and made a joke out of it, wow big <insert bad word here> deal, grow a pair, and quit taking every little joke as an insult. If i was a grammar nazi I'd claim your failure to use commas(as an example) would inherently make you stupid. But I didnt now did I? Nice Try, thats not my style.

I forgot to mention also, that I wasn't pulling out the race card(for the irish fact), i was merely stating a fact, Pulling out the race card, for this topic and with that statement makes absolutely no sense, and surely somebody as intelligent as you would know that. Again nice try.

Quote:

Okay, we'll play my game shall we?
Latin America and South America aren't safe.
http://laii.unm.edu/conference/mesquita.php
Where are the Medellin cartel and the Cali cartel come from? South America.
Howsabout MS-13? South America, but we could say Latin America instead, I'll let you choose.

A six year old article is your response primarily about rising violence is your response? Sounds like you googled the words "Latin America isnt safe", the U.S has had rising violence along the years, does that mean its an unsafe place to live? Wow the number of people who support democracy declined under that basis, I guess Cuba must really not be safe(point taken, because its not, but that doesn't mean the people of Latin America are violent). Note i only skimmed the article/paper. From the way I see you havn't proven your point. Below is a link that you should see. Try again

http://www.netwellness.org/healthtop...violenceUS.cfm

I don't know if debating gets you fired up(its ok if it does, it fires me up too ), or if this is a sensitive topic for you, and anyone who doesnt agree pisses you off, but seriously man your hostility was uneccesary, and I wasnt attacking you, or your credibility. I gave you a rep point for your response to my Next President thread(i think), and I thought you were a cool guy, but I guess i was wrong. Your mood says drunk, and you claim you were drunk when you wrote this, so I'll hold you up on that .

For future reference, I like to joke around alot, and I wasn't trying to make you look like a fool, and im sorry if you feel like I was. I hope your next response has some sanity in it(before you turn red and blow off some steam, IM JUST KIDDING! ). And note im accepting of all opinions, but when you attack me like that, thats where you cross the line.

If you like a challenge I'd be more than happy to give you one, in fact I think i'll make a political thread after posting this, your more than welcome to come, see and comment on it.

Now try not to turn green and go on a rampage, but once again I'm not a grammar Nazi but generalizations is spelled generalizations, not generalisations(im not saying this to make you look stupid so, put down the lamp, damnit put it down, don't throw throw it, it was probably expensive.)

- Kuja

July 4, 2008, 3:02 AM

First things first dear, generalisations is spelt with a 's'. I don't speak bastardized American English, I spell it with a 's' which is correct. The same applies to labour not labor.
Secondly if you did claim I fail to use commas, you must be blind.

Quote:

And I do agree, the job stealing arguement isnt a good one, i put it in there to see how you'd respond, obviously with hostility.

So, if that point is not a good one and you agree with me about that, then you must agree that I was acting perfectly rationally by attacking it. So I don't see what you are trying to get at.

Quote:

Ahh the good ol source arguement, if they were a liberal source would it make it less bias, or less lacking in credibility?

I'm not disputing that liberal sources are biased. However there are no liberal sources, just a conservative one. Please don't take it personally, I was pointing out that it was biased. So that what was being said was only representative of one particular point of view, and that it would only use facts that support its claims. The same goes for any Michael Moore documentry.

Quote:

An eight year old article is your response primarily about rising violence is your response? Sounds like you googled the words "Latin America isnt safe", the U.S has had rising violence along the years, does that mean its an unsafe place to live? Wow the number of people who support democracy declined under that basis, I guess Cuba must really not be safe(point taken, because its not, but that doesn't mean the people of Latin America are violent).

You seem to think that I'm implying that all of Latin America is an incredibly dangerous and horrible place to live. Whereas I'm pointing out that some places are dangerous. The same is true of America.
Which supports my claim that people who come from these violent areas would prefer to live in other places.

Quote:

I don't know if debating gets you fired up(its ok if it does, it fires me up too ), or if this is a sensitive topic for you, and anyone who doesnt agree pisses you off, but seriously man your hostility was uneccesary, and I wasnt attacking you, or your credibility. I gave you a rep point for your response to my Next President thread(i think), and I thought you were a cool guy, but I guess i was wrong. Your mood says drunk, and you claim you were drunk when you wrote this, so I'll hold you up on that .

For future reference, I like to joke around alot, and I wasn't trying to make you look like a fool, and im sorry if you feel like I was. I hope your next response has some sanity in it(before you turn red and blow off some steam, IM JUST KIDDING! ). And note im accepting of all opinions, but when you attack me like that, thats where you cross the line.

I'm highly sarcastic, and my tone reflects that. You may think I'm being offensive but I'm not really.
Did I attack you? Perhaps, but compared to some, I'm rather nice. Personal criticism often goes hand in hand with debating here.
Just so you know, I'm never serious, but when people write things I disagree with,I voice my disagreements. I don't insult people because I find it fun.

July 4, 2008, 3:23 AM

Fair enough, i'm gonna go ahead and assume your from England. Im not american either, but the person who taught me english was, and assuming your from England you guys invented the language so I wont dispute that with you .

Quote:

First things first dear, generalisations is spelt with a 's'. I don't speak bastardized American English, I spell it with a 's' which is correct. The same applies to labour not labor.
Secondly if you did claim I fail to use commas, you must be blind.

I didnt say you failed at comma usage, i said for example in paranthesis(or however you spell it). Although im gonna play devils advocate and assume by saying "if" your saying "if" claiming I did no such thing, but if I did. Also its colour and not color si?

Quote:

I'm not disputing that liberal sources are biased. However there are no liberal sources, just a conservative one. Please don't take it personally, I was pointing out that it was biased. So that what was being said was only representative of one particular point of view, and that it would only use facts that support its claims. The same goes for any Michael Moore documentry.

The problem with what you said about my sources is that, a liberal and conservative source are going to tell you two different things, if i used both for the sake of fairness, it wouldnt make my arguement very compelling, and Micheal Moore is a big fat idiot, but he does sell his ideas in a very clever and furtive way.

Quote:

You seem to think that I'm implying that all of Latin America is an incredibly dangerous and horrible place to live. Whereas I'm pointing out that some places are dangerous. The same is true of America.
Which supports my claim that people who come from these violent areas would prefer to live in other places.

From what you said in your original post, you said "Latin America and South America aren't safe", its hard for anyone to not think you weren't saying that. Never the less I now know that we saw eye to eye on this, and simply missunderstood eachothers words.

Quote:

I'm highly sarcastic, and my tone reflects that. You may think I'm being offensive but I'm not really.
Did I attack you? Perhaps, but compared to some, I'm rather nice. Personal criticism often goes hand in hand with debating here.
Just so you know, I'm never serious, but when people write things I disagree with,I voice my disagreements. I don't insult people because I find it fun.

I don't know man you seemed kinda fired up, and argued your points with flames of passion XD. But I'm not a judgemental person, and ill take your word for it, and now I know your more or less like me in the sense that we both like to fool around while getting our point across. I'm stuck in elder times when people debated peacefully, but thanks for setting things straight, and for opening my eyes to the possibility that some people who dont see eye to eye with me might not be as civil like you.

Quote:

So, if that point is not a good one and you agree with me about that, then you must agree that I was acting perfectly rationally by attacking it. So I don't see what you are trying to get at.

I guess you were justified attacking it, but the problem is, that by trying that you tried to me look like a racist because you tried to claim i was a biggot of immigrants.

You said this: "If they had be taken by citizens, would you care? No, so this works on the assumption that citizens are inherently more deserving than immigrants. Also. it's a fallacy as jobs are given to the best applicant, so if the jobs would have gone to others anyway. However if you were going to say it is because they can pay them less, then the business is breaking the law and would have been closed down anyway, so no jobs are lost.
Jobs arguement fails, though it was a nice try" I highlighted the parts you didn't need to get your point across. Your first sentence is trying to prove that im racist. Anyway now that i look at it, its not that big of a deal.

We'll im glad we could settle this like gentlemen, I'm not a sensitive person, but I don't like it when people attack my points and then try to then label me as something I'm not, I don't care if people think I'm wrong, but I do when they are trying to make me look like a complete idiot for disagreeing with them. (not saying you were trying to).

- Kuja