Does God punish masturbation? - Page 4

March 8, 2008, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Placebo

surely you know that the serpent tricked eve into taking the apple, and is a way of justifying the way the bible treats women.

and sex is not just about pleasure or procreation, it can be about love, surely giving in to temptation is a lesser evil than not expressing love?

Your point might be invalid given that the Bible states that Adan had a choice of refusing the forbidden fruit, yet he decided to eat it. At the same time, the Bible is the best proof to show up that women end up being what influences the decisions made by men, call it, the "power behind the throne". Just like Sparta, women ruled Sparta while their men were sent to war, and while doing so their economy and government was more balanced, and their progress was astonishing. Or Ancient Rome, during the time when women won more power, having the right to rule their own life.

Yes, the story of Adan and Eve is meant to attempt to explain how imperfection was thus born in human hearts, which also explains why dinosaurs aren't mentioned, because the Bible is the story of Humankind after th extinction of the dinosaurs.

Sure, and you must also know that the Bible was written in a different time line than ours.

March 8, 2008, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Placebo

and sex is not just about pleasure or procreation, it can be about love, surely giving in to temptation is a lesser evil than not expressing love?

Eh, this is religion we are dealing with. If you refer to the first point you made:

Quote:

surely you know that the serpent tricked eve into taking the apple

Well firstly, in this story Eve gave into temptation and did what was easy, i.e. ate the apple, with consequences as her and Adam were banished from the Garden of Eden. The moral was that we should resist temptation. Yes, in your eyes it may seem a better thing to express love, just as it seems perfectly okay to show yourself some love because it is enjoyable, doesn't harm anyone, etc. But you are still giving in to temptation, PLUS there is the whole reason WHY it is a sin, the waste of life.

March 8, 2008, 10:35 PM

but then eden isnt the paradice its made out to be.

and the moral may be that we should resist temptation, but then we should resist sex as its pleasurable, but then we wouldnt be procreating.

and blames eve for everything, man having to work, women having to feel pain from childbirth.
and its makes humans impure.

but then pederasty and homosexuality are all sins as they are wastes of life no?

March 8, 2008, 10:36 PM

I personally prefer different stories that explain the point of resisting temptation better, since the bible isn't entirely a great book in my opinion. The theme or consequences of such, rather, is expressed in a lot of other books and movies, particularly movies and books that are done and written well.

But I digress. If there are three reasons why people have sex, one being lust, the other being love, and the other being plain procreation, one would think that the middle choice is the best reason to have sex. At least according to sexual selection. According to sexual selection, if you have sex out of love, it would mean you chose a mate out of having the best qualities, even if you're not aware of them, which will get passed onto your offspring, you will most likely enjoy the sex, and your children are most likely to be fit. Don't think that the pleasure isn't significant at all, because if it were painful, nobody would want to do it.

March 8, 2008, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Placebo

and the moral may be that we should resist temptation, but then we should resist sex as its pleasurable, but then we wouldnt be procreating.

Not if the point of sex IS to procreate, and if you happen to enjoy it then great. Think about it though, say you were a devout catholic who went with this belief, and only had two kids or something. Well, that's a lot of resisting to do.

Quote:

but then pederasty and homosexuality are all sins as they are wastes of life no?

Um, yes. The Catholic religion is also against homosexuality as it is 'unnatural' and there is no chance of any new life.

March 8, 2008, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Um, yes. The Catholic religion is also against homosexuality as it is 'unnatural' and there is no chance of any new life.

so to summarise, the catholic church hates gay people and people who masturbate becasue they are unnatural and not creating new life, yet on the other hand humans are to procreate even though its pleasurable and yet at the same time resist the temptation caused by it being pleasurable?

March 8, 2008, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Placebo

so to summarise, the catholic church hates gay people and people who masturbate becasue they are unnatural and not creating new life, yet on the other hand humans are to procreate even though its pleasurable and yet at the same time resist the temptation caused by it being pleasurable?

'Hate' is such a strong word, the catholic church doesn't 'hate' anyone, but you are basically right. And about the sex part... the point is, sex should only be for procreation. Any other time is sinning because of the waste of potential life and giving in to the temptation.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that I agree with this, these are just the facts.

March 8, 2008, 10:53 PM

According to sexual selection, if you don't resist temptation, it means you don't care about the quality of your offspring, barring the fact you might be using birth control. In most species, particularly mammals, the females are highly selective of their mates, and have few eggs that are difficult to produce, so they must choose wisely. This has nothing to do with morality, but is a scientific fact, and has been observed in many organisms.

If anyone else is interested in the scientific perspective that might shed some light on what most likely happened, I'd suggest reading Dr. Tatiana's Sex Advice for All Creation. It's not dry either; it's a humorous book that's both informative and interesting.

March 9, 2008, 9:02 AM

......Seriously? *Seriously*?

Okay....by asking this question, we are obviously assuming that God exists. So let's go with that assumption. I personally would hope that God has better things to do than look after everyone's masturbation habits.

In short, no. I personally don't think God cares if you whack off. That's just stupid.