Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenChocoboMaster
'ironic for someone who kept complaining about how he disliked politics, yet he does a very typical political move such as that.'
-Well, he is a politician. That doesn't mean he has to like the way our current system works.
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I disagree with this. If he's a politician who dislikes the current system, then he should UPHOLD THOSE BELIEFS. He complains about political tactics, and then he turns around and does the same exact thing that he was complaining about. I would have no problem with him if he voiced his disdain for the political slander-warfare, if he didn't do the same exact thing.
As for the point made about Clinton being a woman and our country not being ready for it, all I have to say...is that when I look at Clinton, I see someone who is fierce, while every time I look at Obama, he's spouting speeches about hope, but once he's put in the hot seat or in a debate, he clams up and then whines about how unfairly he's being treated in this 'cut-throat political process.' This is why I HATE the fact that he's new, because every time he is forced to be confronted by something he dislikes, he hides behind the excuse that it's 'evil politics.' I very, very rarely hear Hillary complain how politics are.
During the Philadelphia debate, Obama answered most of his questions by dancing around the questions, and most of the time...whined about how much he disliked that political tactic. Hillary, on the other hand, answered all of her questions clearly and thoroughly, and with very little hesitance, or mixing of words.
Things that Obama said that troubled me the most:
-Obama was asked about the controversial comments that his Reverend said, and Obama responded by saying that he "wasn't at Church that day," and that he "did not know what was said." And then also said that he had "Disowned" his Reverend.
So, according to Obama, as long as he 'isn't there' and 'doesn't know' what's going on in his Presidency, then he can not be held accountable. That is a HORRIBLE excuse for him to have made.
-When asked about his energy plan for the future, he responds by saying that he will make sure that cars are made with a higher fuel efficiency. Obviously that comment was made from someone with little mechanical knowledge, because in order to achieve higher gas mileage, other components and quality of the car have to suffer as a result. And, that's not my main issue with his statement, it's the fact that he's basically saying: "PEOPLE WILL HAVE TO BUY THESE NEW CARS WITH BETTER GAS MILEAGE." And, on top of that, he mentioned his "$150 billion plan to help the energy crisis," yet he doesn't explain at all where that money is coming from, or what it is going to. At all.
Clinton's response to the same question, was very detailed, and she reminded the public that all of her policies and future plans are laid out and detailed on her website. She plans to investigate the oil companies themselves for price gouging, something that our current Administration has not dared to do...for obvious profit loss of the wealthy oil-stock-holders. She also proposed a plan to research more energy-producing technologies, and creating millions of jobs in the process. More jobs is certainly something this country needs, on top of lower gas prices.
The video that really bothers me the most about Obama:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hU9iCANi02o
I am usually not one to be taken back by videos...but,
COME ON. For someone who is always babbling about how much he loves America and how much great change he promises to bring....
YET HE WON'T EVEN SALUTE THE FLAG?! Some arguments were made that 'standing at attention' is a way to salute the flag. To that..I tell you to pay attention to his stature. He has a slacked posture, and is SWAYING. Everyone else around him is standing tall, still, and saluting the flag. It just gave me such a horrible taste in my mouth when I watched that video.
The main reasons I believe in Clinton:
-Hillary has been on the political track for years and years, and has seen the way the Presidency works through the 8-year term that her husband had run. I'm not saying it's as though she was Bill, but it has surely given her a huge advantage. She knows how this system works, and she knows how to bend it to her will, in order to get work done.
Obama, on the other hand, is 'NEW,' which is NOT a good thing. Why? Because this will likely turn him into another George Bush, a President who is seemingly easily manipulated by all of those around him. And if that isn't the case, then Obama will find it incredibly difficult to get any policies passed and any accomplishments made, because he doesn't know the proper way to go about it.
-Hillary's plan for Iraq and for the Middle East in general is a rather solid plan in my beliefs. She wants to begin bringing back troops after 60 days of her being in Presidency, a brigade at a time. When the prompter said: "But the military feels that the leeway they've made in Iraq would be destroyed," Hillary did not back down. She continued to say that she has watched what has happened in Iraq, and that she believes that the Iraqi people have to be given the opportunity to fend for themselves. America can't spoon-feed a country that doesn't want our help. She believes [And I agree], that American involvement needs to become minimal, so that the Iraqi people can begin to stand on their own two feet and create their own government.
She also mentioned an idea that I really liked. She wishes to become much more diplomatic with the Middle East, and when she was asked if she would declare war on a country that tried to destroy Israel, she said she would protect them, but that she wishes to protect more than them. Her idea was to create a 'security umbrella' of allying countries, where they only had to promise not to use nuclear weapons, and if troubled, the United States would assist them in fighting the other country. That's a war with BENEFIT. We'd be fighting for people who WANT and NEED our help, not people who despise us and try to kill our soldiers constantly.
-People complain that Hillary is dishonest and egocentric, and that her tactics are underhanded. She was even accused of having one of her enemies imprisoned and tortured. There isn't much evidence to back that, but even if that were true: then good for her! She's already demonstrated that she can take down the enemy no matter what the cost. That accusation in itself practically destroys all of the claims that a female politician would be too 'weak' to forcefully handle the enemy.
During the last debate, Clinton was questioned about her exaggeration of her being under 'sniper fire.' Unlike Obama, who, when questioned about his mistakes found a way to say 'it wasn't my fault,' Clinton practically said: "I did it, and I'm sorry." She accepted responsibility for her mistake, and apologized for it. That shows one difference between her and her husband, since Bill liked to keep to "I did not inhale' tactics.
Many people think that Hillary is a bitch, to which I also say: "GOOD!" I don't care if our President isn't a kind person, because a 'bitch' knows how to make things work the way she wants them to. She has been consistent with her beliefs, and I truly believe that she will go to great lengths to make sure that those policies she wishes to make for the benefit of America will be done. She has never demonstrated that her beliefs are in the wrong place, and she's kept with that for years. So what if she isn't a sweetheart? If her intentions are good, then I don't care what 'mean tactics' she takes to get the job done. She acts, whereas I've only seen Obama talk about all the great things he would do, with no explanation of how. Clinton repeatedly said: "This is what I will do, and this is how, and this is where you can read about it."
Clinton, also, on several occasions, has said, even in the debate: "I will do whatever is necessary to get a Democrat in office." She said that when she was asked if she would take Obama at her vice president if she won, or if she'd become his vice president if he won. She has said before that she would team up with him if that's what it took for the Democrats to win the Presidency. That doesn't show a very egocentric and bitchy person to me, but someone who is confident and determined. When asked the same Obama, said that it's 'too early to decide something like that yet.' His ego is
much larger than Hillary's, is what that says.
She's consistent, she's substantial, and she's strong-willed. Obama is all flash, and to me...Obama is like fast food, tastes great going down, but afterward...I'm malnourished and full of regret.
Ending note: I created this thread for ONLY democratic discussion. I'm aware about the 2008 Elections thread, but I ONLY wish to discuss the two democrats here, not the Republicans. I can understand that sometimes McCain may need to be mentioned, since he's the Republican candidate, but this thread is mainly intended to be just about Clinton and Obama, and that's it.
Clinton Vs. Obama 
